Re: IRB Confirms Misconduct Charge Against South Africa Rugby Union

On Jul 8, 6:48 pm, JollyRoger <hcstan...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jul 8, 2:08 am, "Dave (SA)" <david.baker...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:



On Jul 8, 9:04 am, johnmhill <j...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 7, 7:12 pm, JollyRoger <hcstan...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 7, 10:43 am, rhb...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

On Jul 7, 12:08 pm, JollyRoger <hcstan...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 7, 9:44 am, "Simon S-B" <baitt...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Totally agree that something needs to be done about the officials. The
IRB
always points the finger at the laws, but the problem is with the
officials.
Hines ban, Beasts scrummaging, BODs tackle, Botha, Burger, Shaw - all of
these incidents could have been treated differently by another ref on
another day. A high profile test series should not have so much
controversy
over the officiating of it.

That said, the SA protest was I think we all agree the act of a petulant
child who doesn't understand their place in things.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Oh we know our place in things Simon, and we have the silverware and
IRB ranking to prove it.

So what you're saying is you're the best so you can behave like a complete
bunch of twats is it? I'm glad of that because if one of us had suggested it
I'm sure we'd have felt the full force of your persecution complex.

You guys on the other hand...  well you know
where your place is... right?

Jolly

If I were talking about anything to do with rankings you might have a point.
Being as I'm talking about a bunch of childish players and a clown of a
coach doing the most inappropriate and frankly gay thing I've ever seen in a
test, you really don't.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No Simon...  All I'm saying is that *you* of all people should not be
preaching to others about "place", since your union just does'nt have
a lot of international respect right now.

Eh? I'll regret this, but...why does the RFU not have a lot of respect
"right now" (as opposed to any other time)?

And why would Simon's opinion be less (or more) valid just because a
lot of "international people" aren't allegedly respecting England's
rugby union; an organization which Simon neither belongs to, controls
the management of, or about whose current level of international
respect he probably couldn't give a ***?

Geezus Richard, you're pretty uptight for a "has-been" imperialist.
Relax dude...  Did I offend your family in some way, or wot?

I didn't ever say his opinion is less valid than anyone else.  Where
did I say that?  All I said that is that he shouldn't be preaching to
others about their "place".  That assumes some sort of patriarchal
relationship, which would frankly be a huge stretch for a supporter of
the RFU.  I assumed he must be relying on some form of association,
because telling people about their "place" when just speaking for
yourself would frankly be idiotic.

 It would be like me trying
to lecture you on the merits of having a media savy coach.

If you had an opinion on that, why wouldn't it be appropriate for you
to voice it? Would it be hypocritical? Do you moonlight as a coach,
and do you have extremely poor media savviness?

It's about being hypocritical...  I was drawing a parallel in humorist
way...  got it?

Besides, telling people about their "place" is really juvenile in
itself, and is best left to the schoolground.

Why are you so pissy about this? Do you honestly believe the criticism
of the armband thing is misplaced?

I'm not being pissy about it.  As I said, telling people about their
"place" is stupid when you have a weak standing yourself.  My opinion
about whether they were right or wrong in wearing stupid armbands is
irrelevant to this discussion.  (If it makes you feel better, I
disapproved, but I uphold their right to protest)

Jolly

Richard Bridgman

Jolly

Do you think that World rugby has much respect for SARFU after this ?

JH

Hi John

I think world rugby knows that SARU (Not SARFU got renamed I think)
are a tad dysfunctional largely due to our political messes we get
ourselves into
So to be honest I don't think SARU commanded much respect before the
incident.

I think limited individuals on SARU command respect.

We are going to need years before politics lays just a *normal* role
in SARU

Doesn't stop the rugby lovers embracing the game and it won't stop the
same lovers supporting their side.
And that you can't blame us for. SARU <> Springbok or S15 rugby are
not in our eyes the same thing

I am not expecting that world rugby understand everything or that they
make allowances.
I just hope they understand that removing politics is a tough task.

The IRB can do something to control SARU.
I would like it if IRB took a similar stance to FIFA on government
interference.
SA would be banned if they interfered in soccer in the same way. Of
course they don't in that area.

Cheers
Dave

Dave, I fail to see how this is a *political* issue, and how you can
blame it on politics.  Surely you can see that this was something that
was decided on at the team level.  Isn't it funny, that whenever
something goes wrong in SA, the only thing the opposition can ever
resort to is "blame the ANC government"?

Jolly

I have kinda moved off the armband issue and onto SARU's effectiveness
(or not).

Remember politics in SA rugby goes back ages. Apartheid rugby etc.
And the ANC government is no worse at interfering than the old
National govt

My point was that government interference is never good.
Government support of development is great

SARU could have stopped this armband thing from happening (at least
thats my theory)


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