Re: Dear Doug

On 29 Sie, 17:44, -hh <recscuba_goo...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"janus...@xxxxxxxxxxx" <janus...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"Douglas W. \"Popeye\" Frederick" <Pop...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

One rifle per man isn't a lot to brag about.

Do you think that it would be better to take two rifles per man ?

During the Cold War, 10% of the Swiss population was in military
service, along with 35% of their federal budget. That's 3x what the
per-capita is of the USA today, and twice as much as what we're
currently spending with Iraq.

It is quite interesting that during WWII the Swiss managed to mobilize
850,000 force, what comparing to nowadays USA would be 63 million.


In addition to the rifles, there had been 15,000 artillery sites,
frequently hidden in bunkers that are disguised as simple wooden
barns, with all crossroads and similar landmarks in range of each one
already charted on their respective firing tables. There's a small
one open to the public in Faulensee, which was for the defense of
Thun; photo can be seen here:

http://www.swissinfo.org/xobix_media/images/sri/2005/sriimg20050527_5...

There's also the Fortress Museum of Fürigen, outside of Lucern that's
worth a visit as well. Overall, there's dozens of former coldwar
sites now open to the public; see http://www.fort.ch

How many fighters and bombers do they have?

Tanks?

Google swiss military - what a lazy guy

They used to have Mirage III's, but have gone to FA-18's...again,
hardly shoddy equipment.

and 85 F-5s. IIRC Mirages were in service until 1999.


For tanks, they have some, but with their mountainous terrain, their
mobility is highly limited (even before the pre-wired bridges and
tunnels are blown), which is also why they have so much indirect fire
capability.

In the northern part of the country there is enough place for tanks.
The Swiss have two tank brigades (Leopard-2)


They did take a bunch of old turrets and make them into a sort of
'pillbox' emplacements, although these were frequently covered up with
what appeared to be a mere mountainside hut. See:

http://homepage.sunrise.ch/homepage/schwitte/images/Aktuell/R79a-064a...

For more examples of their hidden defenses, see:http://homepage.sunrise.ch/homepage/schwitte/willkommen.htm

Aircraft Carriers?

Maybe it would be helpful for you to have a look at the map of Europe.
Switzerland is landlocked country.

As well as looking at their national doctrinal philosophies, which
tends to exclude things like 'Gunboat Diplomacy' forms of force
projection.

Nukes?

What for?

How about intermediate or long range missles?

What for?

Again, these forms of offense doesn't fit their philosophy.
Nevertheless, they did have air defense, specifically the British-
developed BL-64 "Bloodhound" missile systems; it was old and retired
in 2001, although a facility has been retained for the public to
tour...and it sounds like someone would benefit from a lot of time
spent touring.

Excellent idea.


(even Hitler didn't mess with them)

Out of convenience and collaboration.

Not out of the fear factor you imply.

Douggy, as usual your historical "knowledge" is amazing.

Their 'Reduit' strategy (see:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reduit)
basically made it too expensive to mess with them, for relatively
minimal gain, so they were able to avoid conflict. Cynically, you
could say that this was merely a cost:benefit, but we do have to
remember that historically, there were some incursions and
historically, the Swiss did at times hold POW's from both the USA and
Germany.


According to international law as a neutral country the were obliged
to intern soldiers from both parties (Axis and Allied) and more than
100,000 were interned including about 1600 Americans.
http://www.downing-editorial.com/images/uploads/mil.pdf

Switzerland defense system during WWII was really impressing and there
is little doubt, that attackers would have suffered heavy losses, but
we have to remember that Germany had several war plans to attack
Switzerland, especially in 1940 to outflank Maginot line.
http://theroadtoemmaus.org/RdLb/21PbAr/Pl/WrldUN/Switz01.htm



FWIW, the degree of national preparation is evident to anyone keeping
an open mind and eye open for it. I've personally noticed during
visits (IIRC, near Lenk?) that some of their "pastorial" airfields,
currently used obstensively for recreational gliders, happen to
contain dark grey steel gantries hidden in the adacent connifers,
various funny grass-covered lumps here and there and nearby on a
supposedly simple footpath, for some odd reason, has 100 ton rated
"footbridges", which coincidentally are not far from similarly odd
sidepaths that merely happen to dead end at sets of big, heavy doors
on the side of a mountain.

Similar defense system is employed in North Korea.

Janusz

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Dear Doug
    ... 10% of the Swiss population was in military ... what appeared to be a mere mountainside hut. ... Nevertheless, they did have air defense, specifically the British- ... supposedly simple footpath, for some odd reason, has 100 ton rated ...
    (rec.scuba)
  • Re: Dear Doug
    ... FYI Cold War lasted since 1947 till 1991 and Kruschev was in power ... collaboration with Adolf Hitler and Swiss profiteering off his Jewish ... Germany in the hope that the overall cost of a German invasion would be ... I'm not seeing any evidence of an open mind, but, I do know you have the ...
    (rec.scuba)