Re: Need some help for my dog.
- From: "Yourpetlovesyou" <redshifted@xxxxxxx>
- Date: 16 Jul 2006 20:47:13 -0700
buglady wrote:
"Yourpetlovesyou" <redshifted@xxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1152912035.581420.152470@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
OK, here goes...A few months later
I have a 4 year old Akita/Malamute mix.
They say Kennel Cough, so we treat him for it, and it seems to kinda work.
it's back. Same thing...vet...treatment...better.
..........What did they treat with and how long was the treatment?
///////////Cephalexin. Did nothing. Days/weeks depending on how long
the cough lasted. Whether the drug killed the cough or his own immune
system, beats me.
the sinus discharge gets UNREAL. The poor dog is VERY ill, mucus
pouring from his nose 24/7. He can't sleep, barely eats, he's
miserable. My wife and I didn't get more than 4-5 hours of sleep in a
night for about a
He's had a few fecals, xrays of his head/sinus, tracheal wash, blood
work (a few times). We even had him checked for heartworm even though
it really doesn't exsist around here. His blood was checked for fungi
infection, his mucus was tested twice. He's been on steriods (helped a
little?), every antibacterial/antibiotic/antiviral known to man,
acupuncture, chinese herbal medicine, some of it helped a little, some
not at all.
...........Did they tell you what were they testing the mucus for?
///////////Pretty much everything. i checked his mountain of paperwork
yesterday and they tested for fungii, bac, you name it. Found nothing
really out of range. He was put on ceph, did nothing, then baytril,
did nothing. Actually seemed to make him worse. We assumed allergies
and the meds killed his immune system and made him worse? Stopped the
meds, got him on accupuncture and chinese herbs and he started getting
better. Coincidence?
About 2 weeks ago we took him to the beachUpon returning from the beach...same day...he's caughing and has a runny
nose
Right now he's laying at my feet gasping for air though his mouth cause his
nose is completely full of brownish clear mucus. He's not really slept in
3-4 days.
........So when they x-rayed the head did they find any kind of structural
abnormalities? One of the sites mentioined a protruding tooth root into a
sinus cavity, but I don't know how they could have missed this. Is this all
centered in his head and throat, no lung or upper respiratory involvment?
I'm assuming that they x-rayed the lungs also at some point? Did they
always look normal?
////////No abnormalities. It actually started in the lungs....long
history of coughing, but then the nose...related? maybe, probably? We
just dont know. Still looks like allergies.
...........I went to the Respiratory section of the Merck Vet Manual online
and out of curiosity looked at Nasal Mites first. Not that your dog has
nasal mites, I just wanted to look at the symptoms. (Though apparently
nasal mites are common in Colorado:
http://www.vin.com/VINDBPub/SearchPB/Proceedings/PR05000/PR00197.htm - any
idea where theis dog came from originally?) I was also curious if the nasal
mites hated water and went nuts if the dog inadvertently snorted some
water - a question I don't have an answer for yet. They mention rhinoscopy
and nasal flushing as part of the diagnostic procedures. Were either of
these ever done? I would think if this problem were centered in the
sinuses, that they might have done them. Tracheal washes wouldn't cut it if
it was only in the sinuses. Tracheal washes don't always find what's
present either. At he bottom of the page you can click on Rhinitis and
Sinusitis, but I'd also read most of the other stuff in this section.
http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/121603.htm
////////checking your links....thank you!
......I'm in FL and we have red tides. Red tides give people respiratory
problems even if they don't get in the water. I do wonder if there's
something in the water that is affecting him - algae, etc, that exacerbates
a problem only with contact. Have you walked him on the beach (without
getting in the water) and had no problems? Is this the first time he'd been
in the water since the last time he was sick?
///////////////We have red tides, but he goes to the beach 50 times in
the summer and is fine. We just dont know if the water trips are a
cause or coinc. He goes there all the time and is fine. This last
time he hadnt been in months, and was healthy as ever...then to the
beach we go and he's sick for weeks. But again, he was fine after 50
other trips, and one of the trips that SEEMED to make him sick was
fresh water, and i gotta assume we have an entirly different set of bac
and fungus is salt vs. fresh. however, the bac in bird poop would be
in both? And we have geese in both for sure. We have checked
humidity, weather, pollen seasons, etc and there is no rhyme or reason.
.......Also when you went vet to vet, did you take all test results from
former vets with you? If not, your first step is getting the records from
all the vets who treated your dog so you have a complete record. For vets
you no longer wish to use, this should include their clinical notes. If
you're considering going to a Univ. Vet school clinic, I'd get all notes
and tests from all vets. X-rays can also be borrowed. If they won't loan
them to you to take to someone else, have them send it to the vet you'll be
seeing.
//////////Oh yeah...we carry a freakin book of scans, xrays, med lists,
test results from vet to vet.
I got the following links by Googling Rhinoscopy dog. I'd also Google
Sinusitis dog and Nasal mites dog.
http://www.vin.com/proceedings/Proceedings.plx?CID=WSAVA2003&PID=6527&O=Gene
ric
http://dspace.library.cornell.edu/bitstream/1813/2909/1/2004+Taylor.pdf
I don't think they've done enough to rule out Aspergillosis.
One is on Aspergillosis - Sinoscopy and Rhinoscopy, the other compares
efficacy of X-ray, MRI and CT in diagnosing Aspergillosis:
You should be able to find these JAVMA articles in the Univ. lib or they're
10 bucks apiece online:
http://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/abs/10.2460/javma.228.5.738;jsessionid=icVg
YlWVdF9hW8SYYX?cookieSet=1&journalCode=javma
http://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/abs/10.2460/javma.2004.225.1703?journalCode
=javma
///////////I thought about those as well....I'l check more into it.
These two articles on Rhinoscopy and anatomy of a dog nose cost 15 bucks
each to view in entirety - or if you are near a big U. you might be able to
dig them up:
http://inpractice.bvapublications.com/cgi/content/abstract/28/4/170
http://inpractice.bvapublications.com/cgi/content/abstract/28/5/238
//////////Cool, will check these out.
.........I'd also check online for similar problems in people exposed to
water specifically for your area. This may be something that dogs don't get
very often, but people do. The more reading you do, the better off you'll
be. You could also think about more expensive testing, like MRI or CT, if
it seems warranted.
///////////Good thinking...will check the people problems.
The only similarities in the illnesses is the trips to the water.
One salt, one fresh, different times of year. Goose poop in his
sinus? Pneumonia? Sinusitus? Fungal?
........I keep thinking that the reaction to swimming in water is a key to
diagnosis, but I don't know. It could be that the chronic sinus/nasal
condition has eroded the bones in the area and when water gets in the nose,
perhaps it goes right up into the frontal sinuses.
////////That's kinda what I think too, but who knows.
........He certainly is a handsome pup. I just don't know what to tell you
about the utter discomfort your dog is in now. Does your dog act the same
day and night? Or is it worse at night when he's laying down? You might
try putting a pillow under his head. If no one has suggested a rhinoscopy
or CT/MRI, or even mentioned Aspergillosis, I don't think I could stand to
listen to my dog go through this again. I think I'd be calling up the
emergency dept of the nearest Big U Vet school in your area and be getting
in the car.
//////////That's next for sure. So far with this bout of illness we
have done NOTHING, and it's worked better than anything we have done in
the past, which also points to allergies I guess. He's nowhere near as
bad as he was when the vets tried 20 different things to help him.
It's either the meds were dragging him down, or the allergy shots he's
been on for a few months (they can take a year or more to really kick
in) are working in some way.
.......Best of luck to you and your pup and please post back.
/////////////Thanks for your post. It helped. -Drew
buglady
take out the dog before replying
.
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