Re: OT ~ Not a bad suggestion

On Sun, 13 Dec 2009 11:06:30 -0500, "Carl A. in FL"
<chainfl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

nothermark wrote:
On Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:46:39 -0500, "Carl A. in FL"
<chainfl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

nothermark wrote:
On Sat, 12 Dec 2009 11:34:48 -0500, "Carl A. in FL"
<chainfl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

The unions and their stooges (aka Dems in government) have been in
control of the federal government for three years and we are
experiencing the results now. 0bama has been in office long enough to
have "earned" a Nobel prize, but he hasn't created a significant uptick
in private sector employment, despite wasting $800 Billion of borrowed
money.
OTOH the money is going to folks who were primarily Republican backers
while the UAW took it in the neck. The GM reorganization was not all
that union friendly, it just did not screw the workers as much as the
Conservatives wanted.
Prove to me that the $800 Billion is "going to folks who were primarily
Republican backers."


Sorry, I was thinking TARP funds. I don't know why other than that
has been in the news lately. First order on TARP was the bankers who
probably are supporting the Republicans more than the Democrats but
buy both sides. Now I will think GM.

As has been pointed out many times, especially by LZ, Wall Street
bankers overwhelmingly donated to the Democrats, especially to Chuckie
Schumer. Similarly, the vast majority of the leading financial managers
are registered Democrats. Hank Paulson and Tim Geithner conspired to
panic GWB into going along with TARP. Hank, formerly CEO of Goldman
Sachs, personally profited immensely from saving that I-Bank from the
Goldman Sachs/Lehman Bros. fate. Timmy the tax cheat got to be
SecTreas. Goldman Sachs is a very major contributor to the Dems.


From what I know the settlement totally screwed everybody to some
extent. I could not find a definitive answer about who lost what. I
think that is probably because a lot of it depends on how well the new
GM makes out. I don't know anybody got a free pass on the deal.

The shareholders of GM got wiped out completely, deservedly. I say
"deservedly" because they tolerated an incompetent management that
didn't have the cojones to tell the UAW to take a hike. The SECURED
creditors, who - by law should have been able to force liquidation and
gain control of the assets, got the 0bama cramdown and about 10 cents on
the dollar, if they're lucky. The UAW got control of the company and
now has to negotiate wages and work conditions with itself. Can you
spell "Socialism"?

I don't follow you. From what I see the UAW health care trust ends up
with maybe 20% of the company:

http://blog.aflcio.org/2009/05/29/uaw-members-ratify-gm-agreement/

As I understand it the trust needs to sell the stock as a way to pay
for retiree healthcare over the next 20 - 30 years. One of the issues
is whether they got enough stock to cover the costs involved. It
seems to me that this is little different than giving upper management
stock options. In both cases there is an interest in seeing the
company succeed in order to be able to extract enough profit over the
long term.

If you want to talk socialism worry about the stock the US government
owns. I think they are, or will be, in the same boat as the UAW in
that they weill need to liquidate their holdings over time. Both have
a problem in not dumping too much at once so they keep the price up.
They own more stock so will have more say longer.
.

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