Re: OT- Joe is Back
- From: Gar <olgar2@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2008 18:43:12 -0700
Robert Bonomi wrote:
In article <47dc2f6b$0$31290$c3e8da3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Bruce S <bruce.snell@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"JerryD(upstateNY)" <jerryd@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message news:47dc027b$0$17351$4c368faf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxOwen McKenzie wrote: Even in this short thread the original is much easier to follow. Thats why I prefer bottom posting.<<<<<<Besides this newsgroup, I am on a mailing list where everybody top posts. No one seems to have a problem following those conversations. As I said, I will do whatever the local convention is, because that's good manners, but I see no intrinsic value in bottom posting.
Besides this newsgroup, I post on 5 HTML newsgroups.
None of the HTML groups bottom post and no one has any problems following the thread.
Did someone say that some news readers delete everything after the signature ?
If so, what readers ?
Top posting is suited _only_ for situations where:
1) all messages show up at every location anyone reads messages ate
2) messages show up _in_order_
3) everyone reads *every* message, and 4) the volume of messages, subjects, and contexts is *SMALL*ENOUGH*
that a person can remember "what's what" in _each_ such conversation.
When _any_ of those constraints are violated, top-posting causes problems
Any "missing"/"out-of-order"/"unread" messages and you have to 'scroll down' to the missed message, _read _it_ (with possible/probable broken line-wrap) and then 'scroll up' to the new context.
And that's assuming there was only _one_ missed message -- if there's 6
all top-posted replies in the first message you open, you get to scroll
down over 5 replies, read the original, scroll up over what you just read,
up again over the first reply, read it, scroll up over it, and again over
the next reply, to read the 2nd reply, and repeat for 4 more replies.
If you're _not_ checking in on a newsgroup several times a day, and keeping
up with all the threads frequently, you *don't* necessarily remember what
the state of the current conversation is, even _if_ you've been following it.
Me, I have over 200(!!) newsgroups that I check on regularly -- no way in h*ll
can I keep track of what's what in each conversation in all of those groups.
Especially when a posting and a reply to it may be several _days_ apart.
When replies are consistently bottom-posted I can pick a recent message,
scan it _once_ from top-to-bottom, and be fully caught up on that thread
of the discussion.
when replies are consistently top-posted, I have to scroll across most
of the message *FOUR*TIMES* (once to get to the 'earlier' stuff below
it, a 2nd time to get 'back up' to the beginning of that reply, a third as I read it, and a FOURTH time to get to the reply 'above' it.)
The alternative to that, for top-posted stuff is to pull down all the messages
and read "just the top part" from each one. This means downloading a _LOT_
more stuff, because all the quoted stuff in the later messages is thus redundant, _and_ I have to open all the messages individually. Compare that
to top-posting where I can pull down just _one_ message, and get caught up.
Microsoft, in it's "infinite wisdom", designed Outlook for e-mail WITHIN
a single LAN -- where 'reliable', consistent, time-ordered delivery is
assured, and where the number of 'group discussions' that any single individual will involved in is _small_enough_ that people _can_ track the
state of the discussion "in memory". Especially with the typically short turn-around time for "in-office" e-mail, that methodology was _not_
entirely inappropriate. A set-up where the prior message appeared in the
edit window (In _early_ MS mail-ware, it didn't show) with instructions to
"delete what's not relevant, insert replies immediately below what you are
replying to", would have made their mail _much_ better. This was _well_known_
to people who had actually studied such things. Microsoft knew they could
build a better "anything" than anybody else, didn't consult _any_ 'prior art',
and "invented" everything from the ground up. "Not Invented Here" was the
ultimate pejorative, and a sure-fire feature killer.
*UNFORTUNATELY* Microsoft configured the 'news' side to work the same way
as in-office mail, which is a BAD IDEA(tm). On USENET, messages take different amounts of time to get to different servers, so they show up in
different order. OR there's a glitch, and it gets some places, but not others. Or one news provider has decided there's "too much crap" coming from a particular network and drops *all* messages originating on that network. "Missing messages" _are_ a fact of life on USENET. Top-posting
handles missed messages badly.
I'm convinced, Robert.. I'll be a bottom poster forever.. RORT is the standard bearer!!!
stupid high school teachers.. never did trust em much... :)
--
Ol Gar and Mahoney... in the lil trailer, under the bridge, down by the river...
http://coltonmotorexpress.blogspot.com/
.
- References:
- OT- Joe is Back
- From: william boyd
- Re: OT- Joe is Back
- From: Owen McKenzie
- Re: OT- Joe is Back
- From: JerryD\(upstateNY\)
- Re: OT- Joe is Back
- From: Bruce S
- Re: OT- Joe is Back
- From: Robert Bonomi
- OT- Joe is Back
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