Re: Archive footage of Jimmy Bruno breaking down his theory



"Tim McNamara" <timmcn@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:timmcn-5AE9A1.16540617032010@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
In article
<3f0984bd-f86c-41fd-bab0-6d6cc31f9683@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
335 <335player@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Mar 16, 5:56 pm, ArtistWorks <artistworks...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> As Jimmy's gotten more requests from new students, for the
> explanation of his own theory on making music on the guitar, he
> uncovered this archive footage from JBGI that covers the topic. I
> post it here because its just a really great explanation that might
> be helpful to anyone interested in better understanding where
> Jimmy's head is, especially when he
> improvises:http://www.youtube.com/user/JimmyBrunoJazz#p/u/6/8XlEXkb9
> ufc
>
> He's putting up 2 vids in a series.
>
> Patricia

I have a huge amount of respect for Jimmy and what he's accomplished
in music. And I think it's great that he's willing to post here and
share his experience with the group. But I have to respectfully
disagree that music students shouldn't learn modes and chord scales.
If I understand his point, Jimmy is advising people to learn the
white notes as they would occur on the piano ( major scale) and use
them as a tonal center for making melodies over the chords. Fair
enough. I learned this way too, initially, and I sounded like a
meandering plain vanilla player. It wasn't until I got my arpeggios
and approach notes together, learned to place them on specific beats
and became very concious about how to use passing tones that I
started to sound like I was sort of playing jazz. Learning this stuff
entails knowing something about chord scales even if you don't think
that way when you play.

Jimmy does teach the tonal center method, which per his report is how
the musicians he learned jazz from actually played. He also teaches
arpeggios, passing tones, choosing and contrasting chord tones... and
phrasing so that one plays music instead of scales. What he points out
is that modes add no new notes. D dorian has the same notes as C major.
And, given how he plays, his notions would seem to work fairly well and
"sound like jazz."

On most jazz tunes there are too many chords going by too fast to try to
play by chord scale theory or modal theory. Using tonal centers
(generally) allows you to think in two to eight bar time spaces instead
of two to four beat time spaces.

My experience with Jimmy's method is that it quickly gets down to
playing musical phrases rather than trying to remember the 2nd mode of
the harmonic minor scale when faced with two beats of Dmin7b5. If you
can think that quickly about chord scales and all that, more power to
you. My brain is just not fast enough for that, I guess. Fortunately
the audience and other musicians grade on what you actually play and not
what thought process you use to arrive there.

When I watch instructional videos by guy like Joe Pass or Tal Farlow,
they rarely talk about modes and the like. When they describe their
thought processes, it tends to sound nothing like the discussions we
have here about theory. Pat Martino tends to be the exception in this,
among the videos I have seen.

An awful lot of the jazz theory we discuss here is fascinating, but
seems far too complex to be useful prospectively on the bandstand. Too
much brain processing power required. Someone smarter than me might
have less trouble. I find it easier to think "G7#11... C major scale,
maybe toss in a C# for accent" or "Dmin7b5 = vii or Eb" rather than
trying to remember the 2nd mode of C harmonic minor scale fingerings.
YMMV.

judging from your last paragraph it seems that you're somehow trapped in the same concept you're criticising. you can't isolate a chord and determine what to play over it. if you want to know what to play over Dm7b5 you need to know it's function. it might be a II chord in Cm, a VII in Eb, a sub for III or I in Bb, a sub for I in Ab, and many more. so over Dm7b5 you can play ideas based on all kinds of sounds, dominant, minor, major, diminished and augmented.

there are only two aggregate states in music. all those fancy chord progressions are only meant to obscure this fact in an entertaining matter. the ideal is to eventually not bother anymore if a chord is called Dm7b5, Fm6, Bb9, Abj7b5, or whatever but what harmonic situation it *represents*. fortunately (or not) there are not very many harmonic situations or rather cliches. playing over changes is no rocket science. (it's the rhythmic part that is really tricky ;))

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: What scale/mode?
    ... It's a Bm scale. ... might certainly fit into a paso, but there's no rhythm to the solo. ... you end on an Am chord, ... You can play the cards you're dealt, or improve your hand with DGT. ...
    (alt.guitar.beginner)
  • Re: What scale/mode?
    ... It's a Bm scale. ... It is playable on guitar, ... you end on an Am chord, ... You can play the cards you're dealt, or improve your hand with DGT. ...
    (alt.guitar.beginner)
  • Re: Diminished help
    ... mentioned is simple vizualization.Play a diminished chord at a low point ... on the neck then play it's corresponding scale and arpeggio.Then move ... fingerings for the scales and arpeggios will be the same all of the way ... things to play off the chord being discussed. ...
    (rec.music.makers.guitar.jazz)
  • Re: The case against modes
    ... If everyone who wanted to play jazz got a copy of Slonimsky's book and sang ... If I get a student who already knows modes, then I will use modality to ... notes and keep the chord tones on the beat. ... I asked Red Holloway about Bird and the only scale he mentioned was the ...
    (rec.music.theory)
  • Re: Theory/Improvisation question
    ... jazz tunes don't stay in the same key, ... but after a year I knew nothing about how to play jazz. ... major scale study, yet I still have no idea how to apply it. ... of each chord, or at least think about the chord tones. ...
    (rec.music.makers.guitar.jazz)