Re: obama to win

On Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:16:06 -0400, "elmcmeen"
<elmcmeenHATESPAM@xxxxxxx> wrote:


"Stephen Calder" <calder9@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

What did Bush do that you support?

Didn't you read what I wrote?

I supported the Iraq mission, which also was approved by the UN and a
majority in our Congress.

If it wasn't well handled in certain aspects as a military mission, I
understand that mistakes are made in wartime, and I'll wait for the
military history of the campaign to be written, and study it. If the intel
was wrong in certain respects, well, most of the American politicians
jumping up and down against Bush for political reasons had and believed the
same intel. And WMD included chemical weapons, even if the revisionist
historians want to argue that the term means only nuclear weapons.

And if one wants to point to lies, show me the wording of the Bush speech
which contains a lie. The lies on the other side are mind-boggling.

Iraq is a work-in-process. In American history, America wasn't really
militarily secure until after the War of 1812. People forget that.

I apologize for getting into this; I really didn't intend to do so. The
internet is not the best medium for this stuff, in part because we tend to
stake out and defend our positions rather than interact as humans. I simply
get extremely annoyed at adults making over-the-top statements one way or
the other on Bush or any other human being--even people I'm not enamored of,
like the Clintons or Chuck Shumer. (It's really hard for me to restrain
myself on Chuck, btw.
I need much prayer on this.)

As to Bush, I liked what he did on tax cuts; I didn't like his approach on
immigaration. He was completely AWOL on controlling spending. He seemed
somewhat insensitive on Katrina, but a lot of that was the way the media
played stuff up. He actually was deferring to the local politicians--which
was what they requested initially, before it became clear that blaming
Washington would be the mantra (I understand that Washington wasn't
blameless).

I quit.

E


Ek,

I don't know about the politics behind Katrina, except that they
failed to deliver in a big way. The idea of the USA asking for
humanitarian aid in any crisis borders on the fatuous.

As far as the Iraq war is concerned, the perception in the European
Union was that Bush wanted his war and he was bloody well going to get
it - and he did, not least with the sycophantic support of our own
Tony Blair (who if you take away the Iraq war from his record had a
pretty good premiership). Blair will, however, never be forgiven for
his blindness over Iraq. The French and to a certain extent the rest
of Europe simply took a somewhat jaded view of the histrionics
emanating from the White House and merely said to themselves "It's the
Middle East..they've always been like that." I single out the French
because whilst the US and the UK are particular about who they sell
arms to (ie, they're political about it) the French will sell anything
to anyone, whether it's Eurofighters or nuclear technology.

Hussein was a despot, but as Paul points out in an earlier post he was
supported by the west and by America in particular, partly because he
was seen as the lesser of many evils and partly because of the huge
military industrial complex on which not just the USA but the UK,
France and Sweden depend for many, many jobs and foreign exchange.

Not to mention the Italians - you wanna strike helicopter? Forget Bell
Huey, go straight to Italy and get a cheaper, faster one.

The Saudi Arabian government is despotic to an extent to which Saddam
could only sit back and gasp in awe, yet we are still supplying them
with anything they care to pay for. Same for the Israelis - who appear
to be running a democracy but are at the same time systematically
destroying a culture as old as theirs (in Palestine).

Same old same old, with the difference that at the moment there seems
to be a lot more politics and a lot less genuine diplomacy.

I, for one, have seen enough images of Palestinian women being beaten
nearly to death by Israelis because they were pasturing their goats
within 100m of an Israeli 'settlement'.

What I want to do is get all these people in a big bag and shake them
until they see sense. The middle east is one of the few things which
makes me angry enough to rant. Our entire culture started in
Mesopotamia and what's happening with it now? Western interests are
making money out of a bunch of divided societies who have political
opportunism running through them like Blackpool through a stick of
rock. What a humanitarian mess.

Right, I have to have a shave, take a bath, and light the barbeque,
seeing as it's nice and sunny and I'm not being a poppy farmer in
Afghanistan this weekend.

Pete (don't get me going on Pakistan, Afghanistan, or the poor, ripped
off Catholics in Rio de Janeiro)
.

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