Re: Sound of 'j' and 'z' in Hindi films and songs

On Jul 17, 9:59 am, UVR <u...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jul 16, 5:12 pm, "Afzal A. Khan" <me_af...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:



Asif wrote:
It is with great predicament that I am reviving this topic again, but
this time I have utmost sincerity to do my part in arresting a norm
before it might damage us Indians’ understanding of Urdu language and
some subtleties of English language.  I sincerely want to teach a few
good lessons with the hope that those who learn them will spread it in
their region where this norm of misspelling and probably
mispronouncing the letter ‘z’, sound of which is absent in all Indian
languages and dialects, except Urdu, Dogri, and English.  Is it
present in Punjabi?

So let’s start and take a look at these film titles: Jhumroo (1961),
Saanjh Aur Savera (1964), Manjhli Didi (1966), Jheel Ke Us Paar
(1973), Ankhiyon Ke Jharonkhon Se (1977), and Sachcha Jhootha (1970).
Pay special attention to where the letters ‘j’ and ‘h’ appear together
and in that order.  Now pronounce the letter made up of ‘jh’ and then
pronounce these film titles.  The above titles containing the letter
‘jh’ are all pure Indian words (no Urdu or English), so I am sure you
pronounced them correctly.  There is reason why filmmakers who made
these films titled them as above in film credit rolls.  Anyway, the
way you just pronounced these film titles, just keep them in your mind
for just a few minutes.

Now take a look at these film titles: Zabak (1958), Zindagi (1964),
Zaroorat (1972), Zorro (1974), Zinda Dil (1975), Zamaana (1984),
Zameen Aasmaan (1984).  Pronounce them.  You have trouble pronouncing
them, right?  The reason you cannot pronounce them correctly because
the letter ‘z’ is absent in Indian languages, except Urdu and English
– it is neither ‘j’ (as in Jab Jab Phool Khile or Jalte Badan or Joru
Ka Bhai) nor ‘jh’ (you already learned above that ‘jh’ is not same as
‘z’, right?).  If the sound of ‘z’ were same as the sound of ‘jh’,
then these film titles would have been Jhabak, Jhindagi, Jharoorat,
and Jhameen Aasmaan.  Sure enough, filmmakers of these films knew the
difference and they were right.  Now at least you know that ‘z’ is not
same as ‘jh.  Fair enough.

So let’s get back to ‘z’.  You might have noticed (mostly in film
title rolls) that when a film title, like Zindagi or Zaroorat or
Zamaana, is written in Devnagri script there is a dot at the bottom of
the Hindi letter that stands for the sound ‘j’.  Remember?  This dot
is a way in Devnagri script to denote that it is not really ‘j’ but
‘z’.  I have seen many people spelling names like ‘Jeenat Aman’ (Karan
Johar still calls her Jeenat Aman, and it feels so bad on him – even
Zeenat looked embarrassed by this on his talk show), ‘Jahida’, or
‘Jaroorat’ – they don’t know the difference.

But you have just learned the difference and you are educated,
progressive, and broad-minded enough to correct others’ errors and
teach them.  Believe me that you have a responsibility to right the
wrongs in everyday literature and culture before it is too late.  If
you don’t care and this trend of mixing ‘z’ with ‘jh’ continues, then
the day is not far when someone will make a film and title it ‘Zumka
Gira Re’ or ‘Saanz Ki Bela’.

Asif

       Asif MiaN,

       Perhaps you were inspired to prepare this lesson by a recent post
       on RMIM by Shri Bharat {"Tohfa-Mukesh Song"} where he wrote a line
       from a film song as "Samazo ke mohabbat ho gayee".  The correct
       word, of course, is "samjho".

       However, permit me to offer a correction or comment on your above
       lesson.  You wrote (and I quote) :

           "The above titles containing the letter ‘jh’ are all pure
            Indian words (no Urdu or English), so I am sure you
            pronounced them correctly."

       There is no need to distinguish "Indian" words from Urdu words.
       Urdu too is (primarily) an Indian language, though it is under -
       stood and spoken in many parts of the world.

       There was a time when the dot under the Devnagri "j" was rigorous-
       ly placed in all instances requiring the "z" sound.  The practice
       seems to have all but disappeared.

       Afzal

Asif saahib,

Proper pronunciation has taken a beating in all languages.  It's no
secret to RMIM that it gets me riled up also.  But why must we make an
exception of Urdu?  Why must we make a big deal of the 'z', why must
we hold up the 'j-dot' as an example of how things are going wrong?
Is it the claim that 100% of all Urdu-knowing people pronounce all
Urdu words "correctly"?  I hope not, because, well, just go walk the
streets of Lucknow or Lahore, and you'll have your answer.

-UVR.

UVR Sahab:

I agree with you that a lot of supposedly Urdu-speaking people cannot
pronounce 'z' correctly. But the main topic of my post is not about
it. It is about incorrectly using 'z' letter for the 'jh' sound. I
just cannot believe that some people correctly use 'kh' (Khiladi),
'th' (Thodi Si Bewafai), 'chh' (Chhalia), 'bh' (Bhuvan Shome),
'dh' (Dharmatma), 'ph' (Phansi), and 'gh' (Ghar), and yet they use 'z'
for 'jh'.

As for Afzal Sahab's comment about Urdu, I agree that it is primarily
an Indian language. Elsewhere on my original post I did include it as
an Indian language.

For those who want to learn how to pronounce 'z': try to speak 'ja'
without touching your tongue with teeth or walls of your mouth. Then
try to listen to or watch Rafi, for example, singing on youtube, or an
actor (preferably Dilip Kumar, Bharat Bhushan, Raj Kapoor, Rajendra
Kumar) lip-synching, a song like 'zindagi bhar naheen bhoolegi' etc.

Asif
.

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