Re: that "rap's most artistic albums" thread
- From: Haroon <halqahtani@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 21:56:33 -0400
The Grand Imperial Diamond Shell.
On 2009-09-20 17:05:08 -0400, suntzu <suntzu@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> said:
"If you had to select hip-hop albums that reach a higher
artistic plateau than excelling at the the specific qualities
typical for the genre, which would they be? Albums that
artistically (NOT stylistically) point beyond the mere artform
of hip-hop/rap."
i thought this was a really cool topic, and didn't get a chance to reply when it was originally posted. i'm posting a reply as a new thread so that if no one replies to this, it's not because it wasn't seen.
matt, i'm still not quite sure what you mean by your artistic vs stylistic distinction, but i'm guessing "artistic" is whatever feelings you think it's important for art in general to express and "stylistic" has more to do with mixing in elements from genres outside of hip-hop. if that makes any sense. like you want things where there's no question about them being rap albums, but they're still adventurous?
(matt, bozak) for outkast, i think any of their albums could probably qualify, but the 2nd and 3rd are the best examples, IMO. i think after the first one, they all aim equally high, it's just that 2 and 3 are the best executed. i could see either of the tribe albums you guys mentioned, but "marauders" is the on i'd go with. i agree with "doomsday" being on there, but i have a hard time not adding "madvillainy" and "geedorah" to the list too. "nation of millions" of course. i wouldn't have thought of "the chronic" (even though it is one of my favorite albums), but i can kind of see it. also, i want to see how the new mos def ages after a few years. i think it stacks up pretty well against the first one (both in general and as far as this specific topic goes).
(mocha) for de la, i think the first album is more off the wall and maybe more innovative because of that, but i wouldn't say it's more artistic. there's a certain craft and focus on "is dead" that "3 feet" doesn't have, and i think that can be just as valid an aspect of being artistic as being innovative. personally, i like "is dead" more, but i think both belong on the list.
(attl) "the score" is a good call. i think i agree with "efil4zaggin" too.
stuff others didn't mention that i'd add:
gravediggaz - 6 feet deep
dr. octagon - dr. octagonecologyst
UGK - ridin dirty
jay-z - reasonable doubt
raekwon - OB4CL
masta ace - sittin on chrome
count bass d - dwight spitz, begborrowsteel
el-p - i'll sleep when you're dead
stuff that i'm not sure about but kind of want to add:
camp lo - uptown saturday night
ghostface - ironman
goodie mob - soul food
nas - illmatic
heat sensor - touch ep
viktor vaughn - vaudeville villain
scarface - the diary
warren g - regulate... g funk era
i'm surprised i didn't think of any west coast stuff, unless you count octagon since automator produced it. and warren g, which i was on the fence about.
in the case of the stuff on the second list, those are all albums that i love, i'm just not quite sure how well they fit matt's criteria (they feel like they might be too straight-forward to qualify, or like they differentiate themselves stylistically more than artistically, though that differentiation is what i'm least clear on).
.
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