Re: The "Religion of Peace" In Their Own Words.......

Liberal_Logic? wrote:
"Ray" <rayblee@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1140764131.718943.183960@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Liberal_Logic? wrote:
"Ray" <rayblee@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1140720007.236175.253810@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Liberal_Logic? wrote:
"Ray" <rayblee@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Liberal_Logic? wrote:
the Bush National Guard documents thing. Didja notice how that
"issue" totally fell off the face of the earth the day after the
administration
finally coughed up those coveted documents? I have yet to hear a
peep.

Actually, that issued continued for long afterwards and is still
unresolved - those "coveted documents" raised more questions about
Bush's national guard 'service' than they answered.

Then WHY didn't the Dems continue using the issue to
bash Bush during the campaign? The dems just gave
him a pass out of the kindness of their hearts I suppose.

After the "Swift Boat Veterans For Truth" organization ran a barrage of
highly successful (from a political standpoint) ads that falsely
attacked and unfarily dishonored Kerry's Vietnam War service record,
MoveOn.org ran an ad attacking both Swift Boat lies and Bush's national
guard service.

Kerry responded by specifically condemning the MoveOn.org ad, declaring
that the presidential campaign should be about issues, not personal
attacks. (Compare with Bush, who never specifically condemned the
Swift Boat ads, even as John McCain condemned them as dishonest and
dishonorable.) After Kerry's condemnation of the MoveOn.org ad many
(though not all) Democrats followed his lead and stopped highlighting
Bush's spotty and still highly questionable national guard record.

I don't buy that for a second.
If there was anything usable in those docs it would have been used.

Boston Globe, September 8, 2004:
---------------------------------------
Bush fell well short of meeting his military obligation, a Globe
reexamination of the records shows: Twice during his Guard service --
first when he joined in May 1968, and again before he transferred out
of his unit in mid-1973 to attend Harvard Business School -- Bush
signed documents pledging to meet training commitments or face a
punitive call-up to active duty.

He didn't meet the commitments, or face the punishment, the records
show. The 1973 document has been overlooked in news media accounts. The
1968 document has received scant notice.
---------------------------------------

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/09/08/bush_fell_short_on_duty_at_guard/

So why wasn't it used?

I already told you. See above.

And if you don't think that many Kerry allies backed off the subject
because Kerry denounced the highlighting of the subject with the
declaration that the presidential campaign should be about issues and
not personal attacks, then why do you think the Kerry campaign and many
of their allies on the left didn't highlight Bush's spotty and highly
questionable (at best) national guard record?

You want me to believe this sequence of events:

You can believe whatever you want to believe, but the FACT of the
matter is Bush's national guard records show that he didn't meet his
commitments, or face the punishment for doing so. And if you disagee,
specifically what part(s) of the information presented in that Boston
Globe article do you believe are untrue, and why?

The media are surely in large part responsible for the said state of
'debate' during political campaigns. However it's not the media who,
for example, concocted and launched the 'Kerry is a flip-flopper' smear
campaign - that was instead Bush and his allies.

Agreed, but the way you tell it Kerry didn't have a smear machine
of his own.

Can you name a personal attack that Kerry's people unfairly smeared
Bush with as noticably, effectively, and repeatedly as Bush's people
smeared Kerry with the 'Kerry is a flip-flopper' personal attack? Or
Bush's allies did with the Swift Boat lies?

I'm not talking about just the "official" ads where the candidates have
to say: "I am XXXXXXXX and I approve of this message".

So would you agree then that there were no, or relatively few, official
"Kerry smear machine" dishonest attack ads when compared to official
"Bush smear machine" dishonest attack ads?

The indipendant
liberal smear ads on Bush (AND the reverse toward Kerry) were too numerous
to count. Still, from the way you argue your point above, it wasn't the
actual
ads that bothered you as much as the fact that Bush's were BETTER! LOL!

No, I'm making the point that there were no, or relatively few,
official "Kerry smear machine" dishonest attack ads when compared to
official "Bush smear machine" dishonest attack ads. For example, there
was no equivalent to the 'flip-flopper' ad campaign on the Kerry side.

Also, even with unofficial ads it is my view that there were far fewer
*dishonest* attack ads from Kerry's supporters than there were from
Bush supporters. For example, there was no equivalent to the Swift
Boat ad campaign on the Kerry side.

I really think there should be some serious BI-PARTISAN legislation
to stop those inane independent negative ads. (And the official ones
for that matter.) I know that's a colossal can -o- worms with freedom
of speech, but SOMETHING needs to be done before 2008. Those
ads hurt BOTH sides and do absolutely nothing for the debate on
the important issues.

Negative ads are a huge problem - on that we agree. However unlike
you, apparently, I believe that people have - and should have - the
Constitutional right to say negative things about political candidates
who are both in office and otherwise, and in ads as well as otherwise.

Ray

.

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