Re: Mystery Orchestra 6

On 3 Mar, 15:52, "Michael Schaffer" <ms1...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Mar 3, 7:28 am, "CharlesSmith" <sigma.onl...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:





On 2 Mar, 18:31, "Michael Schaffer" <ms1...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Here is Mystery Orchestra 6. It is a pretty long file (29MB), but I
thought that would be OK because yousendit is really fast and nobody
complained about the length of clips so far (on the contrary, some
asked for more). Let me know if you find it too long/big, I can also
prepare a shorter excerpt. But I don't want to go lower than 320kbps.

The last round went to Jeff again, and I am pretty sure he will be
able to identify this very quickly, too. So far, Jeff is the
uncontested MO champ, so as the title holder, I am asking him again to
hand in his answer to me by email so the young talent gets a chance to
play, too.

What me? Young talent?

I've managed to join yousendit and download the file.

You should also be able o download it directly with the long direct
link I posted later, without logging in. I tried it with different
browsers, but I am not sure if Yousendit set cookies in connection
with that action which allow only me from my computer to access the
files without logging in. I looked for the cookies and didn't find
any, but you never know.

Try this link and let me know if it takes you directly to a download.
You don't actually have to download the whole file again. If you get
the download dialog from your browser, you know you are already there:

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=check_download&ufid=299F....

I'm not
particularly fond of this piece, so my interest in its interpretation
is less than for previous rounds. I've listened through. I think
Stravinsky makes orchestra spotting difficult - he perhaps didn't
compose with this game in mind - by using the extreme registers of the
instruments, so it's hard to compare sounds with expectations at more
normal pitches.

I don't know what you mean. Half the clip is slow and lyrical material
with plenty of instrumental colors in regular registers.





Some points I've picked out:
At 3.40 the Circles is played very expressively by the solo strings
At 4.10 (as an example) the low flute is unnaturally loud, so must be
very closely miked
At 6.00 the oboe tone is quite reedy
At 7.10 to 7.30 the trumpets are very shrill
At 8.15 and onwards note the fabulous timp sound
At 9.00 seems rather fast - jogging along rather than ritualistic
At 10.44 the high loud horns are lean and mean
At 12.30 at the start of the sacrificial dance, this is on the slow
side, and the string chords are held long with cresc, which mimics the
brass chords

As to who is playing I can only hazard guesses. I don't think its
American because of the occasional shrill sound, especially that horn
sound. On the other hand might a French conductor such as Monteux or
Boulez persuade an American orchestra to play like that? And of course
whatever the orchestra, a horn section playing high and loud with
their bells in the air sounds like a horn section playing high and
loud with their bells in the air.

I think you are confusing yourself here. American orchestras are in
particularly known for their cutting and strident brass sound in
forte, in fact they often pride themselves of that. So if that is what
you are hearing, you are making the totally wrong conclusion.

There are different grades of cutting brass sound. I have plenty of
examples on my cd shelf. Even when American brass is cutting, they
tend to maintain a stable core tone and rich harmonics. I think the
sounds in ex6 are more lean, mean and brash than I expect from an
American orchestra.

Which
doesn't mean I am telling you your conclusion is right or wrong. It's
just the process of analysis is totally confused, so you arrived there
by accident and confusion. Listen again. At this point, you can also
listen to comparative samples of orchestras from various region to get
a feeling what kind of sound they have in those extreme passages. But
forget about amazon samples. They don't tell you anything at all about
that.

I quite agree. But they've shown that someone else plays the
sacrificial dance in the manner in ex6, for what it's worth.

As an aside I've found on a quick scan through Amazon that Haitink and
the London Philharmonic play the sacrificial dance as I describe in
the sample. However I don't think this is Haitink (like I didn't think
the last round was Muti) and the timp sound doesn't match (but it's
difficult to be sure on an Amazon sample).

For no particularly good reason I think its more likely to be Järvi
and the Suisse Romande. Very speculative.

Don't get "desperate" and start guessing wildly. You already confused
yourself in the last round and almost had the right answer but managed
to talk yourself out of it, for no reason at all. You can do much
better. You seem to hear pretty well even though you may not be able
to put your finger to what you are hearing.

I did not "almost" have the right answer in the last round. I had it.
I was diverted by my ignorance of what Muti could do (conspiring with
Peter) and by your emphasis on some clue that I would find in the
introduction. This turned out to be evidence of Frenchiness, which was
irrelevant to my investigation since I was already clear that the
orchestra was French.


MO champion Jeff has already positively identified the clip (I think
it took him only a few minutes), so there is "nothing to lose" at this
point. But we can stll have some interesting blind reviews.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text

I don't know where to go from here, and there will anyway be an
intermission while I head off to hear James MacMillan's thoughts on
theology and music (and also some live music).

.

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