Re: The best ever arrangement of Air on a G String

"Slogoin" <larry@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:6e9dd6f3-faf0-491f-8d6a-7bede8bd6cd4@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On Aug 15, 11:42 am, "Steve Freides" <st...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
* Why do you see it as a core subject?

I think you'll have to ask the ancient Greeks that question, or look
at
the YMCA motto (maybe it's their old motto by now) of Mind, Body,
Spirit. I believe music is an integral part of being a well-rounded
human being. It touches on things no other subject touches. The
question is rather like asking why it's important to read and write
one's native tongue because speaking it is sufficient. I can't answer
that one any better than I just answered yours.

** So what about painting and drawing?

Yes, the visual arts ought to be in there, too. (Please note that I
flunked handwriting in fifth grade, btw.)

I will add, per the YMCA motto above, that I believe learning to use
one's body athletically is just as important as learning music, and
again one needn't aspire to being a professional athlete any more than
one need aspire to being a professional musician. Mind = school, Body
=
exercise/sports, Spirit = music/religion/philosophy - at least that's
how I see being a well-rounded person, and I see the job of an
education
as trying to produce a well-rounded person.

* Well integrated may be the better choice of words for
* a multidisciplinary approach. A well connected person sees
* subjects as synergistic rather than mutually exclusive.

Of course, but they are most often broken up into separate subjects for
the purpose of teaching. That's another whole discussion entirely,
e.g., at Mannes, we taught things in a very compartmentalized manner,
but the end result, according to most graduates, was very well unified.

This is why things like the fact that
every third grader learns to play the recorder in our local schools
pleases me to no end! They also all play an instrument in fifth
grade
in the band or orchestra, another very good thing!

* Should K-12 teachers be required to play at least one
* musical instrument well enough to play simple songs?

Most kindergarden teachers sing with their classes - at least most I
know. An instrument isn't necessary.

As to qualified to teach, that's a can of worms. For a starter,
those
who can teach well privately and those who can teach well in a
classroom setting are often not the same people.

* Often they are the same people, perhaps more often than not.

I also don't believe that
_anyone_ is a good teacher, either privately or in a classroom,
until
they've had a few years of experience. I consider my own efforts in
both areas at the start to have been pretty awful, and I'm confident
that I've learned and gotten better from my experience and will, I
hope, continue to learn and continue to get better as I continue to
teach.

* Most professionals continue to update their education. Do you
* still study education on your own? Is the subject something you
* are as interested in as your interest in music?

No, I don't study education. I believe my experience is my best
teacher, along with the feedback I receive from students and those who
supervise me, e.g., I have found my supervisor at the community college
to be very helpful. She sat in on one or two of my classes and gave me
good feedback, and she's also been a good sounding board for me as
regards teaching at this particular place.

Exactly what you think it does - they're quiting just when they're
learning how to do the job well.

* I suspect music teachers turnover rate is much lower. I remember a
* composer friend saying he met the widow of the professor who's job he
* just got at the first faculty dinner before classes started.
* Awkward... That was a real world view of the job market joke about
* waiting for someone to die to get a job at any of the universities.

* The other thing I wonder is how much the extra two years of
* college studying education helps teachers learn the art?

Don't forget that there are a lot of different kinds of music
teaching.
My wife started out on the mus ed track and was taking courses that
included learning how to play all the instruments in a typical school
band and orchestra so that she could teach them. For what I now do and
also for what she now does in music education, those courses are
completely unnecessary.

* Lots of education is unnecessary for the jobs we do. Like you said,
* a well rounded person...

I agree.

OTOH, I have a course in group dynamics that she didn't (I took it
just
because I wanted to) and I found what I learned there quite valuable,
although I have to confess I don't think I made the connection in any
useful way until I'd been teaching for at least a few years.

* A good teacher is a lifelong learner. Teaching is a great way to
* learn and IMO something that should be taught to everybody since
* everybody needs to understand to be well educated. We all need to
work
* on the problem of education if anything is really going to change.

As I said, neither my wife nor me has ed credentials, although my wife
did take a course or two about five years ago as part of what's called
the Alternate Route to getting ed credentials, and she thought the
course was great and that she learned a lot. (If you follow the
Alternate Route, you take a few courses then must secure a job that
will
sponsor/mentor you while you teach and simultaneously take the rest of
the required courses. It's most often used by people with professional
expertise that school districts want to hire but that don't have ed
credentials.)

I teach college classes and one-on-one lessons both at the college and
at home; my wife teaches at a private middle school that didn't
require
ed credentials - they hired her because she'd taught at a nursery
school
for 4 years (also didn't require ed credentials) and at the community
college (again, didn't require ed credentials, just a masters degree).

* Why do we require two years of education classes if so
* many music teachers have no training in education yet
* seem to do well?

I don't know the answer to your question, and I don't think the answer
is specific to music. If you ask a lot of people in a lot of fields,
they'd tell you that their formal training was, at best, only partial
preparation for their eventual job responsibilities. That's life -
it's
like trying to teach people how to be parents. Lord knows there is no
training possible that can even remotely prepare you for that one, so
you learn "on the job."

* There is a LOT of learning most people could do to be better
* parents BEFORE they do it. In fact the basics of simply caring for
* children in many cultures is something that friends of mine have been
* very involved with. It begins with basic nutrition and basic family
* systems work to change some of the destructive cycles of behavior
* found in so many homes. We could do a lot to change things by
* understanding the cultures of the students we teach especially in
* K-12.

We all learn on the job in whatever our field;
that's the way it's always been and the way it always will be.
Training
seems to help, so those entrusted with giving the training do the best
they can and we thank them for their efforts.

* Kinda scary if you are talking about your neurosurgeon.

What do you call a person who graduates first in their class in medical
school?

Doctor.

What do you call a person who graduates dead last in their class in
medical school?

Doctor.

(The rest of the joke, as it was told to me: What do you call a physical
therapist who graduates first in their class? A physical therapist.
What do you call a person who graduates dead last in their class? A
chiropractor.)

Training, yes, but formal, no. I lived in a co-op house with a bunch
of
ed-psych majors for a year in the 70's and worked with them a bit as
well, and I gleaned a lot of knowledge from that, but I've never had a
course in the subject of education.

* Do you study education on your own any more?

I am always trying to do better, looking for new things to teach, new
ways to teach, new materials to use, and even am giving consideration to
writing my own theory book for use at the community college. I don't
teach the courses I teach over and over in the same way twice, I hope -
I try to keep what works and replace what I think might be done better
another way. Is that "studying" education? No. Could I benefit from
the study of education? Probably yes, and if I had the time and the
money, I would. Right now, I'm teaching as much as I can and playing a
little, doing my best to make ends meet around here.

But this is all part of the beauty of teaching music to
non-musicians -
there is no career to be worried about at the end, just helping people
enrich their lives.

* Teaching anything should enrich the lives of the student and the
* teacher, that's the beauty of teaching.

Well said.

-S-


.

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