Re: Global warming test!

BrianNZ wrote:
Henry wrote:
BrianNZ wrote:
P.Roehling wrote:

But after literally hundreds of Hen3ry's posts

You can't find =one= that supports your accusation.
Reason being, of course, is that you are a psychotically
obsessed lying sack of ***. I love it when a critic
exposes himself as a liar, a coward, and a delusional
nut case. <vbg>

P. "I'm not psychotic at all" Roehling wrote:

Hen3ry has stated in the past that it's obvious that
the Pentagon was hit with a cruise missile, and not an
airliner.

Petie, your crippling obsession and your psychosis are
worsening. I said no such thing. I don't know what hit the
Pentagon, and I don't dwell on it because unlike the demolition
of WTC7 and the towers, the evidence is inconclusive. I've said
that before.
On the outside chance that you're not a psychotic lying sack of
***, and I don't remember what I wrote, you'd be able to produce
a post where I claim a cruise missile hit the Pentagon. Tell ya
what, Petie - you quote a post where I say what you claim I said,
and I won't write another political or 9-11 related post to rec.
motorcycles for at least a year - and I'll apologize for wrongly
insulting your admirable character!
But of course, you won't find that post, and you probably lack
the honesty, integrity, and self respect to admit your mistake.
So, I expect you'll just slither away in shame and disgrace....

As predicted.... <vbg>

Here you go hank/henry....here's a post of yours from a couple of
days ago.....Does it ring any bells!?

Here's a line from your quoted article below........

" the firing of a missile into the Pentagon and a host of other
documented proofs that the Bush regime was behind the attacks"

Those aren't my words.

Just as I predicted....but, but , but.....

There's no "but" about it. Those are definitely not my words.
They were written by a man named Gerard Holmgren. You, like psycho
Pete, are lying about what I wrote. You are attributing someone's
else's word s to me. In fact, that author clearly states that his
writing is copyrighted.
We know that you magic fire conspiracy kooks are desperate to find
even just =one= false or inaccurate statement that can be attributed
to me or other 9-11 truth seekers, but when you resort to such blatant
stupid lies, you only make us look better, and the conspiracy kooks
look desperate, delusional, or even psychotic. We've come to expect
that sort of insanity from psycho Pete, but such a stupid blatant lie
is puzzling coming from you...

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/JohnJudge/linkscopy/DCTPFA911.html

by Gerard Holmgren, 9 January 2003

Copyright Gerard Holmgren. Jan 9 2003.
This work may be freely copied and distributed without permission as
long as it not for commercial use. Please include the author's name, the
web address where you found it and the copyright notice.
From: EcoNews Service <econews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sunday, February 16, 2003 1:05 PM

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/JohnJudge/linkscopy/DCTPFA911.html

Debunking Conspiracy Theorists Paranoid Fantasies About Sept 11 Distract
From the Real Issues

by Gerard Holmgren, 9 January 2003

Copyright Gerard Holmgren. Jan 9 2003.
This work may be freely copied and distributed without permission as
long as it not for commercial use. Please include the author's name, the
web address where you found it and the copyright notice.
From: EcoNews Service <econews@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sunday, February 16, 2003 1:05 PM



Astute observers of history are aware that for every notable event there
will usually be at least one, often several wild conspiracy theories
which spring up around it. "The CIA killed Hendrix" "The Pope had John
Lennon murdered", "Hitler was half Werewolf", "Space aliens replaced
Nixon with a clone", etc, etc. The bigger the event, the more ridiculous
and more numerous are the fanciful rantings which circulate in relation
to it.

So its hardly surprising that the events of Sept 11 2001 have spawned
their fair share of these ludicrous fairy tales. And as always, there is
-- sadly -- a small but gullible percentage of the population eager to
lap up these tall tales, regardless of facts or rational analysis. One
of the wilder stories circulating about Sept 11, and one that has
attracted something of a cult following amongst conspiracy buffs is that
it was carried out by 19 fanatical Arab hijackers, masterminded by an
evil genius named Osama bin Laden, with no apparent motivation other
than that they "hate our freedoms."

Never a group of people to be bothered by facts, the perpetrators of
this cartoon fantasy have constructed an elaborately woven web of
delusions and unsubstantiated hearsay in order to promote this garbage
across the internet and the media to the extent that a number of
otherwise rational people have actually fallen under its spell.

Normally I don't even bother debunking this kind of junk, but the effect
that this paranoid myth is beginning to have requires a little rational
analysis, in order to consign it to the same rubbish bin as all such
silly conspiracy theories. These crackpots even contend that the
extremist Bush regime was caught unawares by the attacks, had no hand in
organizing them, and actually would have stopped them if it had been able.

Blindly ignoring the stand down of the US air-force, the insider trading
on airline stocks -- linked to the CIA, the complicit behavior of Bush
on the morning of the attacks, the controlled demolition of the WTC, the
firing of a missile into the Pentagon and a host of other documented
proofs that the Bush regime was behind the attacks, the conspiracy
theorists stick doggedly to a silly story about 19 Arab hijackers
somehow managing to commandeer 4 planes simultaneously and fly them
around US airspace for nearly 2 hours, crashing them into important
buildings, without the US intelligence services having any idea that it
was coming, and without the Air Force knowing what to do. The huge
difficulties with such a stupid story force them to invent even more
preposterous stories to distract from its core silliness, and thus the
tale has escalated into a mythic fantasy of truly gargantuan proportions.

It's difficult to apply rational analysis to such unmitigated stupidity,
but that is the task which I take on in this article. However, it should
be noted that one of the curious characteristics of conspiracy theorists
is that they effortlessly change their so called evidence in response to
each aspect which is debunked. As soon as one delusion is unmasked, they
simply invent another to replace it, and deny that the first ever
existed. Eventually, when they have turned full circle through this
endlessly changing fantasy fog , they then re-invent the original
delusion and deny that you ever debunked it, thus beginning the circle
once more.

This technique is known as "the fruit loop" and saves the conspiracy
theorist from ever having to see any of their ideas through to their
(ill)logical conclusions. According to the practitioners of the fruit
loop, 19 Arabs took over the 4 planes by subduing the passengers and
crew through the use of guns,knives,box cutters and gas, and then used
electronic guidance systems which they had smuggled on board to fly the
planes to their targets.

The suspension of disbelief required for this outrageous concoction is
only for the hard core conspiracy theorist. For a start, they
conveniently skip over the awkward fact that there weren't any Arabs on
the planes. If there were, one must speculate that they somehow got on
board without being filmed by any of the security cameras and without
being registered on the passenger lists. But the curly question of how
they are supposed to have got on board is all too mundane for the
exciting world of the conspiracy theorist. With vague mumblings that
they must have been using false ID ( but never specifying which IDs they
are alleged to have used, or how these were traced to their real
identities), they quickly bypass this problem, to relate exciting and
sinister tales about how some of the fictitious fiends were actually
searched before boarding because they looked suspicious.

However, as inevitably happens with any web of lies, this simply paints
them into an even more difficult corner. How are they supposed to have
got on board with all that stuff if they were searched? And if they used
gas in a confined space, they would have been affected themselves unless
they also had masks in their luggage. "Excuse me sir, why do you have a
boxcutter, a gun, a container of gas, a gas mask and an electronic
guidance unit in your luggage?" "A present for your grandmother? Very
well sir, on you get." "Very strange", thinks the security officer.
"That's the fourth Arabic man without an Arabic name who just got on
board with a knife, gun or boxcutter and gas mask. And why does that
security camera keep flicking off every time one these characters shows
up? Must be one of those days I guess..."

Asking any of these basic questions to a conspiracy theorist is likely
to cause a sudden leap to the claim that we know that they were on board
because they left a credit card trail for the tickets they had purchased
and cars they had rented. So if they used credit cards that identified
them, how does that reconcile with the claim that they used false IDs to
get on to the plane? But by this time, the fruit loop is in full swing,
as the conspiracy theorist

tries to stay one jump ahead of this annoying and awkward rational
analysis.They will allege that the hijackers' passports were found at
the crash scenes. "So there!" they exalt triumphantly, their fanatical
faces lighting up with that deranged look of one who has just a
revelation of questionable sanity. Hmm? So they got on board with false
IDs but took their real passports with them?

However, by this time the fruit loop has been completely
circumnavigated,and the conspiracy theorist exclaims impatiently, "Who
said anything about false IDs? We know what seats they were sitting in!
Their presence is well documented!" And so the whole loop starts again.
"Well, why aren't they on the passenger lists?" "You numbskull! They
assumed the identities of other passengers!" And so on...

Finally, out of sheer fascination with this circular method of creative
delusion, the rational sceptic will allow them to get away with this
loop, in order to move on to the next question, and see what further
delights await us in the unraveling of this marvelously stupid story.
"Uh, how come their passports survived fiery crashes that completely
incinerated the planes and all the passengers? "

The answer of course is that its just one of those strange co-
incidences, those little quirks of fate that do happen from time to
time. You know, like the same person winning the lottery four weeks in a
row. The odds are astronomical, but these things do happen...

This is another favourite deductive method of the conspiracy theorist.
The "improbability drive", in which they decide upon a conclusion
without any evidence whatsoever to support it, and then continually
speculate a series of wildly improbable events and unbelievable
co-incidences to support it, shrugging off the implausibility of each
event with the vague assertion that sometimes the impossible happens
(just about all the time in their world).

There is a principle called "Occam's razor" which suggests that in the
absence of evidence to the contrary, the simplest explanation is most
likely to be correct. Conspiracy theorists hate Occam's razor. Having
for the sake of amusement, allowed them to get away with with the silly
story of the 19 invisible Arabs, we move on to the question of how they
are supposed to have taken over the planes. Hijacking a plane is not an
easy thing to do. Hijacking it without the pilot being able to alert
ground control is near impossible. The pilot has only to punch in a four
digit code to alert ground control to a hijacking.

Unconcerned with the awkward question of plausibility, the conspiracy
buffs maintain that on that Sept 11, the invisible hijackers took over
the plane by the rather crude method of threatening people with
boxcutters and knives, and spraying gas (after they had attached their
masks, obviously), but somehow took control of the plane without the
crew first getting a chance to punch in the hijacking code. Not just on
one plane, but on all four.

At this point in the tale, the conspiracy theorist is again forced to
call upon the services of the improbability drive. So now that our
incredibly lucky hijackers have taken control of the planes, all four
pilots fly them with breath taking skill and certainty to their fiery
end, all four pilots unflinching in their steely resolve for a swift
meeting with Allah. Apart from their psychotic hatred of "our freedoms",
it was their fanatical devotion to Islam which enabled them to summon up
the iron will to do this. Which is strange, because according to another
piece of hearsay peddled by the conspiracy buffs, these guys actually
went out drinking and womanizing the night before their great martyrdom,
even leaving their Korans in the bar -really impeccable Islamic behavior
-- and then got up at 5am the next morning to pull off the greatest
covert operation in history.

This also requires us to believe that they were even clear headed enough
to learn how to fly the huge planes by reading flight manuals in Arabic
in the car on the way to the airport. We know this because they
supposedly left the flight manuals there for us to find. It gets better.
Their practical training had allegedly been limited to Cessnas and
flight simulators, but this was no barrier to the unflinching certainty
with which they took over the planes and skillfully guided them to their
doom. If they are supposed to have done their flight training with these
tools, which would be available just about anywhere in the world, its
not clear why they would have decided to risk blowing their cover to US
intelligence services by doing the training in Florida, rather than
somewhere in the Middle East, but such reasoning is foreign to the foggy
world of the conspiracy theorist, too trapped in the constant rotation
of the mental fruit loop to make their unsubstantiated fabrications seem
even semi-believable.

Having triumphantly established a circular delusion in support of the
mythical Arabs, the conspiracy theorist now confronts the difficult
question of why there's nothing left of the planes.

Anybody who has seen the endlessly replayed footage of the second plane
going into the WTC will realize that the plane was packed with
explosives. Planes do not and cannot blow up into nothing in that manner
when they crash. Did the mythical Arabs also haul a huge heap of
explosives on board, and mange to deploy them in such a manner that they
went off in the exact instant of the crash, completely vapourizing the
plane?

This is a little difficult even for the conspiracy theorist, who at this
point decides that its easier to invent new laws of physics in order to
keep the delusion rolling along. There weren't any explosives. It wasn't
an inside job. The plane blew up into nothing from its exploding fuel
load! Remarkable! Sluggishly combustible jet fuel which is basically
kerosine,and which burns at a maximum temperature of around 800 C has
suddenly taken on the qualities of a ferociously explosive demolition
agent, vapourizing 65 tons of aircraft into a puff of smoke. Never mind
that a plane of that size contains around 15 tons of steel and titanium,
of which even the melting points are about double that of the maximum
combustion temperature of kerosine -- let alone the boiling point --
which is what would be required to vapourize a plane. And then there's
about 50 tons of aluminium to be accounted for. In excess of 15lbs of
metal for each gallon of kerosine.

For the conspiracy theorist, such inconvenient facts are vaguely
dismissed as "mumbo jumbo". This convenient little phrase is their
answer to just about anything factual or logical. Like a conjurer
pulling a rabbit out of a hat, they suddenly become fanatically
insistent about the devastating explosive qualities of kerosine,
something hitherto completely unknown to science, but just discovered by
them, this very minute.

Blissfully ignoring the fact that never before or since in aviation
history has a plane vapourized into nothing from an exploding fuel load,
the conspiracy theorist relies upon Hollywood images, where the effects
are are always larger than life, and certainly larger than the
intellects of these cretins. "Its a well known fact that planes blow up
into nothing on impact." they state with pompous certainty. "Watch any
Bruce Willis movie." "Care to provide any documented examples? If it's a
well known fact, then presumably this well known fact springs from some
kind of documentation -- other than Bruce Willis movies?"

At this point the mad but cunning eyes of the conspiracy theorist will
narrow as they sense the corner that they have backed themselves into,
and plan their escape by means of another stunning backflip. "Ah, but
planes have never crashed into buildings before, so there's no way of
telling." they counter with a sly grin.

Well, actually planes have crashed into buildings before and since, and
not vapourized into nothing. "But not big planes, with that much fuel ",
they shriek in hysterical denial. Or that much metal to vapourize. "Yes
but not hijacked planes!"

"Are you suggesting that whether the crash is deliberate or accidental
affects the combustion qualities of the fuel?" "Now you're just being
silly". Although collisions with buildings are rare, planes frequently
crash into mountains, streets, other aircraft, nosedive into the
ground,or have bombs planted aboard them, and don't vapourize into
nothing. What's so special about a tower that's mostly glass?

But by now, the conspiracy theorist has once again sailed happily around
the fruit loop. "Its a well documented fact that planes explode into
nothing on impact." Effortlessly weaving back and forth between the
position that its a "well known fact" and that "its never happened
before, so we have nothing to compare it to", the conspiracy theorist
has now convinced themselves ( if not too many other people) that the
WTC plane was not loaded with explosives, and that the instant
vapourization of the plane in a massive fireball was the same as any
other plane crash you might care to mention. Round and round the fruit.
loop...

But the hurdles which confront the conspiracy theorist are many, and
they are now forced to implement even more creative uses for the newly
discovered shockingly destructive qualities of kerosine. They have to
explain how the Arabs also engineered the elegant veritcal collapse of
both the WTC towers, and for this awkward fact the easiest counter is to
simply deny that it was a controlled demolition, and claim that the
buildings collapsed from fire caused by the burning kerosine. For this,
its necessary to sweep aside the second law of thermodynamics and
propose kerosine which is not only impossibly destructive, but also
recycles itself for a second burning in violation of the law of
degradation of energy.

You see, it not only consumed itself in a sudden catastrophic fireball,
vapourizing a 65 ton plane into nothing, but then came back for a second
go, burning at 2000C for another hour at the impact point, melting the
skyscraper's steel like butter. And while it was doing all this it also
poured down the elevator shafts, starting fires all through the building.

When I was at school there was a little thing called the entropy law
which suggests that a given portion of fuel can only burn once,
something which is readily observable in the real world, even for those
who didn't make it to junior high school science. But this is no problem
for the conspiracy theorist. Gleefully, they claim that a few thousand
gallons of kerosine is enough to: completely vapourize a 65 ton
aircraft: have enough left over to burn ferociously enough for over an
hour at the impact point to melt steel ( melting point about double the
maximum combustion temperature of the fuel ): still have enough left
over to pour down the elevator shafts and start similarly destructive
fires all through the building.

This kerosine really is remarkable stuff! How chilling to realize that
those kerosine heaters we had in the house when I was a kid were deadly
bombs, just waiting to go off. One false move and the entire street
might have been vapourized. And never again will I take kerosine lamps
out camping. One moment you're there innocently holding the lamp -- the
next -- kapow! Vapourized into nothing along with with the rest of the
camp site, and still leaving enough of the deadly stuff to start a
massive forest fire.

These whackos are actually claiming that the raging inferno allegedly
created by the miraculously recycling, and impossibly hot burning
kerosine melted or at least softened the steel supports of the
skyscraper. Oblivious to the fact that the smoke coming from the WTC was
black, which indicates an oxygen starved fire -therefore, not
particularly hot, they trumpet an alleged temperature in the building of
2000 C, without a shred of evidence to support this curious suspension
of the laws of physics. Not content with this ludicrous garbage, they
then contend that as the steel frames softened, they came straight down
instead of buckling and twisting and falling sideways.

Since they're already re-engineered the combustion qualities of jet
fuel, violated the second law of thermodynamics, and re-defined the
structural properties of steel, why let a little thing like the laws of
gravity get in the way?

The tower fell in a time almost identical to that of a free falling
object, dropped from that height, meaning that its physically impossible
for it to have collapsed by the method of the top floors smashing
through the lower floors. But according to the conspiracy theorists, the
laws of gravity were temporarily suspended on the morning of Sept 11.

It appears that the evil psychic power of those dreadful Arabs knew no
bounds. Even after they were dead, they were able, by the power of their
evil spirits, to force down the tower at a speed physically impossible
under the laws of gravity, had it been meeting any resistance from
fireproofed steel structures originally designed to resist many tons of
hurricane force wind as well as the impact of a Boeing passenger jet
straying off course.

Clearly, these conspiracy nuts never did their science homework at
school, but did become extremely adept at inventing tall tales for why.
"Muslim terrorists stole my notes, sir" "No miss, the kerosine heater
blew up and vapourized everything in the street, except for my
passport." "You see sir, the schoolbus was hijacked by Arabs who
destroyed my homework because they hate our freedoms."

Or perhaps they misunderstood the term "creative science" and mistakenly
thought that coming up with such rubbish was in fact, their science
homework. The ferocious heat generated by this ghastly kerosine was,
according to the conspiracy theorists, the reason why so many of the WTC
victims can't be identified. DNA is destroyed by heat. (Although 2000 C
isn't really required, 100C will generally do the job.)

This is quite remarkable, because according to the conspiracy theorist,
the nature of DNA suddenly changes if you go to a different city. That's
right! If you are killed by an Arab terrorist in NY, your DNA will be
destroyed by such temperatures. But if you are killed by an Arab
terrorist in Washington DC, your DNA will be so robust that it can
survive temperatures which completely vapourize a 65 ton aircraft.

You see, these loonies have somehow concocted the idea that the missile
which hit the pentagon was not a missile at all, but one of the hijacked
planes. And to prove this unlikely premise, they point to a propaganda
statement from the Bush regime, which rather stupidly claims that all
but one of the people aboard the plane were identified from the site by
DNA testing, even though nothing remains of the plane. The plane was
vapourized by the fuel tank explosion maintain these space loonies, but
the people inside it were all but one identified by DNA testing.

So there we have it. The qualities of DNA are different, depending upon
which city you're in, or perhaps depending upon which fairy story you're
trying to sell at any particular time. This concoction about one of the
hijacked planes hitting the Pentagon really is a howler. For those not
familiar with the layout of the Pentagon, it consists of 5 rings of
building, each with a space inbetween. Each ring of building is about 30
to 35 ft deep, with a similar amount of open space between it and the
next ring. The object which penetrated the Pentagon went in at about a
45 degree angle, punching a neat circular hole of about a 12 ft diameter
through three rings ( six walls).A little later

a section of wall about 65 ft wide collapsed in the outer ring. Since
the plane which the conspiracy theorists claim to be responsible for the
impact had a wing span of 125 ft and a length of 155 ft, and there was
no wreckage of the plane, either inside or outside the building, and the
lawns outside were still smooth and green enough to play golf on, this
crazy delusion is clearly physically impossible.

But hey, we've already disregarded the combustion qualities of jet fuel,
the normal properties of common building materials, the properties of
DNA, the laws of gravity and the second law of thermodynamics, so what
the hell -- why not throw in a little spatial impossibility as well? I
would have thought that the observation that a solid object cannot pass
through another solid object without leaving a hole at least as big as
itself is reasonably sound science. But to the conspiracy theorist, this
is "mumbo jumbo". It conflicts with the delusion that they're hooked on,
so it "must be wrong" although trying to get them to explain exactly how
it could be wrong is a futile endeavour.

Conspiracy theorists fly into a curious panic whenever the Pentagon
missile is mentioned.They nervously maintain that the plane was
vapourized by it's exploding fuel load and point to the WTC crash as
evidence of this behavior. (That's a wonderful fruit loop.)

Like an insect which has just been sprayed, running back and forth in
its last mad death throes, they first argue that the reason the hole is
so small is that the plane never entered the wall, having blown up
outside, and then suddenly backflip to explain the 250 ft deep missile
hole by saying that the plane disappeared all the way into the building,
and then blew up inside the building (even though the building shows no
sign of such damage). As for what happened to the wings -- here's where
they get really creative. The wings snapped off and folded into the
fuselage which then carried them into the building, which then closed up
behind the plane like a piece of meat.

When it suits them, they'll also claim that the plane slid in on its
belly, (ignoring the undamaged lawn) while at the same time citing
alleged witnesses to the plane diving steeply into the building from an
"irrecoverable angle."

How they reconcile these two scenarios as being compatible is truly a
study in stupidity. Once they get desperate enough, you can be sure that
the UFO conspiracy stuff will make an appearance.

The Arabs are in league with the Martians. Space aliens snatched the
remains of the Pentagon plane and fixed most of the hole in the wall,
just to confuse people. They gave the Arabs invisibility pills to help
get them onto the planes. Little green men were seen talking to Bin
Laden a few weeks prior to the attacks.

As the nation gears up to impeach the traitor Bush, and stop his
perpetual oil war, it's not helpful to have these idiots distracting
from the process by spreading silly conspiracy theories about mythical
Arabs, stories which do nothing but play into the hands of the extremist
Bush regime.

At a less serious time, we might tolerate such crackpots with amused
detachment, but they need to understand that the treachery that was
perpetrated on Sept 11, and the subsequent war crimes committed in
"retaliation" are far too serious for us to allow such frivolous self
indulgence to go unchallenged.

Those who are truly addicted to conspiracy delusions should find a more
appropriate outlet for their paranoia. Its time to stop loony conspiracy
theories about Sept 11.




--

http://911research.wtc7.net
http://stj911.org
http://stopthelie.com/1-hour_guide_to_911.html
http://www.911truth.org



Here's what happens to steel framed buildings exposed
to raging infernos for hours on end.

http://davesweb.cnchost.com/nwsltr69c.html

On 9-11-01, WTC7, a 47 story steel framed building, which
had only small, random fires, dropped in perfect symmetry
at near free fall speed as in a perfectly executed controlled
demolition.

http://911research.wtc7.net/talks/wtc/videos.html
http://wtc7.net/articles/FEMA/WTC_ch5.htm


Ever wonder who benefits from the 300 MILLION
U.S. taxpayer dollars spent each DAY in Iraq?
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0223-08.htm
http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?list=type&type=21

"They are waging a campaign of murder and destruction. And
there is no limit to the innocent lives they are willing to
take... men with blind hatred and armed with lethal weapons
who are capable of any atrocity... they respect no laws of
warfare or morality."
-bu$h describing his own illegal invasion of Iraq.
http://www.robert-fisk.com/iraqwarvictims_mar2003.htm

http://www.commondreams.org/
http://www.truthout.org/
http://www.prohibitioncosts.org/
http://thirdworldtraveler.com/
http://counterpunch.org/
http://responsiblewealth.org/

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things
that matter." -- Martin Luther King Jr.

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President,
or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is
not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
-- Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

Don't let bu$h do to the United States what his very close
friend and top campaign contributor, Ken Lay, did to Enron...
.