Re: Ownage

On Aug 13, 11:03 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
2. assuming you DO know, how would you expain it then?

I've already explained it. Uke is taking the falls deliberately. You
can tell by the fact that he occasionally reacts before the old guy
moves, and by the fact that his "falls" backward are obviously being
intentionally drawn out.

I meant that you should explain how push hands is *supposed* to work,
and then explain why it is bad from that standpoint.

Stop trying to change the subject, Ollie. YOU are the one claiming
that what we're seeing in the clip is real, and that you know how it
works. Yet you keep coming up with reasons not to back up those
claims with anything real. If you don't know just admit you don't
know and we'll move on to something new.

I know. But how is this changing the subject? If you don't know, then
we can't discuss it. So far you have said you don't believe it is
real, and I have asked you for an explanation. I've already explained
in other posts why I believe something is going on here. If all you
have to say is "no it isn't" over and over then what can I do? :)

Personally, I don't believe it works at all. I'd be like explaining
how Superman can fly; interesting in a geeky sort of way, but utterly
non-productive.

Humor me.

For example. Which of the 36 push hands sicknesses is Huang
demonstrating, if any? Can you discuss it at this level?

Can YOU?

Sure I can - I've demonstrated that ability in previous posts in this
thread.

Seems you're the one claiming to know it - why can't YOU
discuss it?

I have. Here watch, I'll do it again. Let's discuss if the head pat at
3:13 in the Huang clip is a manifestation of /ke da/ ("It looks like
using something to knock against something else directly(1)"). We
could also talk about exactly what happened at 1:35. Is this /duo
shan/ or /li/ or something else? What about 3:22? Is this /Na/ or /
Gou/ or something else?

Am I wrong in my assessment? Please, let's discuss. I want to
understand.

I haven't asked you anything unreasonable Ollie... I'm
merely asking you to explain the thing that you said you'd LOVE to
explain if only you had an audience that was interested. So once
again, the ball is your court. Will you play?

The question is not if I will play; I have demonstrated both
willingness and ability to do so in the past. At any rate, the ball
has now been passed to you. Let's see what you come up with.

I see... Okay then. Let me play along, please. Let's pretend it
doesn't work. Are you able to explain how it is *supposed* to work,
that is, how it's *intended* to work, and then explain why it doesn't
work from that standpoint? Serious question!

Again, I am not the one claiming to know anything about it.

Then how do you expect to understand, let alone continue, the
discussion I have started above?

I don't
personally care how it's supposed to work, any more than I care how
Warp Drive is supposed to work. You're the one making the claim - you
support it. Funny how you're so utterly unwilling to explain the
thing you said you'd love to explain, now that someone is actually
asking you.

Someone who doesn't care.. who admits they are incapable of answering
a question about it, contributing anything, or even merely following a
discussion about it.. This is the person who is telling me I am wrong.

I'm asking you to explain what you claim you're seeing in that video.

I'm seeing real skill but there is always room for improvement :)

Simple as that - in your own words, tell us what you're seeing. Don't
worry about the technical jargon - if there are question on that, sure
you being the expert you are can answer those questions, right?

I don't have the time to teach you for free, dude.

The truth, Ollie, is that you are most certainly NOT interested in an
academic discussion.

Oh? See above.

That is the last thing you want. What you want
is the same thing you always want: You want someone else to elaborate
on your claims so that you can either agree or disagree, depending on
which way you think the conversation is heading.

Kind of like the stock market ehh? No, I don't think so. I've been
saying the same thing on here for years, Shuurai. I think back to some
of the stuff I was saying 10 years ago and it's all the same stuff.

So it's real simple. Either back your claims or retract them.

I've backed my claims up sufficiently so that it would take someone
with real knowledge of the art or the man to contribute further to
this discussion. See above.

It's not about me, shuurai. It's about a couple of push hands videos.
I just want to talk about them.

So talk about them.

done in the past, done in this message, will be done in the future..

1. search for "jerk-wave", i'm too lazy to look it up, it was
something i asked evins about in this thread

Giving it a name doesn't make any more real. Warp Drive has a name;
it's still fiction.

You sound a lot like someone who doesn't have the ability to detect
the movement I am describing. Others have. Why not you? Better
question; why do you believe you are the final authority on reality
when it comes to interpreting this video? Can you admit that maybe,
just maybe.. you misjudged it?

2. see matthew's post athttp://groups.google.ca/group/rec.martial-arts/msg/e347316e3462c2a9?h...
Due to what matthew said (and I believe it was the last thing he said
in this thread) I think he "gets it" now.

Seemed more like he just got tired of trying to get through to you.

Kind of like how you are going to feel when you realise you're wrong,
I really do want an academic discussion and no, you don't have a hope
in hell of participating in it because you are *unable to*. It doesn't
mean you're a bad person shuurai. If I am wrong, then don't talk about
talking about it - just talk about it.

There is a difference between me teaching you and sharing knowledge.
It isn't sharing if you have *nothing* to offer.

-

.

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