Re: And yet more shiao jiao clips


"Eric D. Berge" <eric_berge @ hotmail.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:la5s82h1tbtk7qk5785kmftf01ptueumba@xxxxxxxxxx
On Mon, 12 Jun 2006 18:38:07 GMT, Rabid Weasel
<lawson@NO24856SPAM+dayton.net> wrote:


He
hasn't read any of the standard references in English on Japanese
martial arts, and throws around racist sneers at some of the most
respected scholars in the field, I suppose to save himself the effort
of cracking a book.

Cite on a "racist sneer", please, if you're going to make the accusation.
Although if I remember correctly, the last time you made a lot of derogatory
assertions and then avoided the followup cites. Quite the ethics, you judo
types.



The same seems to be true of the term "Shuai Jiao", btw, rather like
"wrestling" in English can mean either "the set of all grappling
techniques" or "Amateur Freestyle" or "WWF", depending on context -
last time this discussion came up I made an honest effort to get Mike
to say whether he was using SJ as an umbrella term for all wrestling
from China (as some references seem to use it), or for a specific
style with a specific curriculum and competition ruleset, and a
specific lineage of teachers.

I used the term "shuai jiao" just as the Chinese use it. Live with it.



After watching him dance and gibber like a monkey on crack to avoid
answering, it finally dawned on me that he really has no idea.

Look dumbass... it was me last time that explained that shuai jiao, the
term, can be used in several ways. And I think if you'll look at some of my
posts recently on some forum or other you'll find that I did a fairly good
explanation of all the ways the term is used. Berge.... trust me, your
little foray into some brief Shuai Jiao doesn't give you any edge on the
general topic.


He has
no direct experience with Shuai Jiao; has never practiced it, never
competed in it, doesn't have a clue what techniques are included in
the curriculum, couldn't tell you what is tournament legal, doesn't
know what relationship, if any, Chen Gempin's teachings in the 17th C.
have with modern Shuai Jiao (can't really blame him for this one -
_no-one_ knows what CG taught. Other than literature, that is).

The only thing that he does know for sure is that Shuai Jiao is
Chinese, and he has a quasi-religious idee fixe about everything
Chinese being the One, the Only, the Original, and by Golly, Better
Than That Stuff From Japan.

No, that's silly, too. I'm on record in too many places saying various
things the Chinese did they got from India. Does that make me an
India-phile? You miss the point. If Japanese swords came originally from
China, saying so doesn't have any national connotations. About the only
people left who are dumb enough to think that the 'ju' arts (yes, it's
correct to call them "arts" in this usage) were a purely Japanese invention
is a bunch of provincial western "judo teachers" that have assured
themselves that they already know everything. And hey... I'm just happy to
get you on record again because it's nice to have it in the files. ;^))))

Think of it like this. If you're right, I'm an ignorant jackass and my
credibility in these issues is zilch. Fair enough. If I'm right, which I'm
boringly certain that I am, then Holmes and Berge are two "teachers" that
have admitted to some very basic level errors in knowledge by what they've
posted on rma. If these are indeed keystone levels of knowledge that
self-styled "teachers" really should know, then it's on record. Let's say 3
years from now you get enough data to realize that I wasn't just making this
up and I was right. It comes up with enough side support that you can't
even lie your way out of it. At that point (and it will come), I will point
out that you cannot be real experts because you could not have started
training any of the qi or jin things long enough to be "expert" because you
didn't even know what they were in June of 2006... as per your posts on rma.
Get it? ;^)

Regards,


Mike


.

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