Re: Assumption of standard

On 18 Feb, 00:56, Martin Goldstraw <heraldryad...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Feb 18, 12:57 am, Greg <scoti...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

 The question
of course arose as to why someone with no [legitimate right] to
display a standard along side those armigers who have received the
right - by petition and award - to display banners of their own.  This
type of display sets up a confusing model.

Greg,
You have failed to explain why you think that a citizen of the United
States has no legitimate right to display a standard.
Your logic is flawed. You yourself display arms which are used
legitimately simply because there is no law to prevent you from doing
so and the option to petition for official recognition is not
available to you. And yet according to your logic you should not
display your arms alongside those who have received arms by right - by
petition or award.

For a citizen of America the assumption of a standard is exactly the
same, in terms of display, as the assumption of arms. Logic should
dictate that if an American can correctly assume those armorial items
that he would otherwise be able to freely petition for in another
country, a country which would in your parlance give him a right to
those items of display by petition or award, then he may freely do so
without criticism from the ignorant.

An Englishman who would qualify for armorial bearings can also, by
right and with no obstacles save for the additional cost, petiton for
a badge and have that badge exemplified on a standard. In other words
a plain and simple English armiger has the right to use a standard if
he so chooses. Translating this to an American who chooses to become
armigerous and takes the only route available to him, which is
assumption, he has the same right to assume a standard as he does to
assume arms. He does not pretend to any greater rank or significance
that that of his English friend who has the route of legitimacy
available to him.

You make the same fundamental mistake as the original poster in this
thread; you think that an American must base the use of arms upon the
Scottish law of arms where an "ordinary" armiger can not use a
standard. There is absolutely no reason why someone who is not
Scottish and does not reside in Scotland should feel obliged to follow
the Sottish model - Try telling the many "ordinary" Englishmen who
have a legitimate right to display a standard that they must follow
Scottish laws and see what reaction you get.

Martin

Martin, let's start from the top. Any American can assume anyhthing.
If I chose to I could have a 16ft standard flying from my roof. I
could use a standard as an avatar. You didn't know that I had a
standard made some time ago, just to see what it would like. It's
nice, but I don't use it.

When purveyors of Rolls of Arms allow assumtions to step outside of
the accepted display of arms it sets a bad precedent. Do other
assumed arms in your Register have gold trim on their helms? I also
note that the helm of the arms in question faces front - that's bad.

Scotland is a great model - that's all. If I wanted to display a
standard in the amrs section of teh society, would it be okay? I
mean, why not. Everybody with assumed arms should be able to do
whatever we want - right?

You've said nothing else in your post that isn't just defensive side
stepping.
Face it Martin; you're just taking people's money, and that's too
bad. You got your finger caught be another mouse trap and you're -
upset.

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Assumption of standard
    ... right - by petition and award - to display banners of their own. ... States has no legitimate right to display a standard. ...
    (rec.heraldry)
  • Re: Burkes International REegister of Arms
    ... Manchester Palace of Varieties 1954, ... the display of the arms in the auditorium of the theatre, ... use of the arms in the City as the common seal of the Defendent Company. ... ground for intervention by this Court. ...
    (rec.heraldry)
  • Re: Burkes International REegister of Arms
    ... Manchester Palace of Varieties 1954, Heraldry Society 1955] ... the display of the arms in the auditorium of the theatre, ... use of the arms in the City as the common seal of the Defendent Company. ...
    (rec.heraldry)
  • Re: Burkes International REegister of Arms
    ... "Read the judgement, which refers to display without distinction ... You have taken the words 'with regard to the display in the auditorium ... display of arms was not contrary to the law of arms. ... "To deal then with the present complaint, ...
    (rec.heraldry)
  • Re: Burkes International REegister of Arms
    ... I think a court would have reservations about finding againt 'mere ... If the arms are 'displayed' mainly to make money then I ... etc. inns and pubs displaying the arms of others mainly to make ... :) I think it would be difficult to object to display - goodness the ...
    (rec.heraldry)