Re: Finals time limits (again)

On 15 Aug, 16:56, Peter D Bakija <p...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <1187180507.469873.155...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,

witness1 <jwnewqu...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
You don't get to the finals by sucking.

And yet a final that ends with a 5 way time out? That indicates that, in
fact, you suck.

Gah - I really disagree with this comment :o) seems very harsh to me.


Except when, regardless of trying as hard as they can to oust their
prey, no one can get an oust on their own. This is what I've actually
seen.

This happens incredibly rarely. Yes. I have seen it as well. But in,
like, 1 game in 100. 5 way time outs in finals do not come from, in the
vast majority of the time, everyone being at a systematic deadlock. It
comes from people not wanting to get ousted, and so they take no
calculated risks.

More than that, I've seen it a fair few times. I do conceed that
players are more cautious in finals, and probably need more sureties
in a final than in a round or a casual game when going foreward..
thats not 'sucking' imo - just a symptom of the different lansdscape
of a final.

David Tatu suggested in an e-mail (sorry if I'm outing you Dave, I just
didn't want to take the credit for the idea :-) a reasonable idea, which
is change the final game to have 1 winner (determined however you
currently determine a winner) and then 4 finalists, regardless of the
actual scores. So winning gives you an advantage (prizes, fame, glory,
chicks, whatever) but moving from 5th place to 4th place has no impact
at all. Rating points and prizes are exactly the same for places 5-2 in
the tournament final. So the ratings score would look like:

-Player A: First place, a lot of points.
-Players B-E: Finalist, less points, but all the same points.
-Players F+: Places 6+.

That is a farking grweat idea, nice and simple.

This would not result in ties (saving us from my Marxist "It's ok if the
tournament ends with a 5 way tie..." worldview), but would remove the
incentive of players 2-5 to try and stay alive and increase their
position in the final ("Well, I can't win, but I can move up to
3rd..."). Without that incentive, players 2-5 lose nothing at all by
getting killed trying for the oust--coming in 5th is exactly the same as
coming in 2nd.

If 5th place and second place get you the exact same thing (same prizes,
same rating points, same notation in the player registry), it ceases to
be a good idea to try and just stay alive for the .5 time out VP instead
of taking the less likely chance to oust someone.

Strikes me as a far more brilliant idea than mine.

Yup, agreed, your idea sucked :p

Because
a) If you don't break ties, you don't have a tournament winner. Which,
IMO, defeats the point of bothering to have a tournament. The point of
a tournament is to declare a winner.

See, I think the point of a tournament is to play some good games. I'm
not really concerned with declaring a winner, really. But that is me.
And mostly irrelevant at this point.

Ties eliminate the point of bothering with tournaments at all.

I don't think that is remotely true. But again, irrelevant now.

I think he was exagerating, but IMO you do need a winner ina
tourny :O)

Peter D Bakija

Anthony


.

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