Re: Poll: roguelike keyset vs. regular keyset

On Sep 28, 2:20 pm, Hallvard B Furuseth <h.b.furus...@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
But in this case there actually isn't any.

If you are going to declare something to have no logic, start by
finding out why it is the way it is. And for that matter, if you
are going to tell us what kind if keyboards we should use, start
by finding out how they _are_ designed and why. See below.

[Warning: hostile detected. Elevating to DEFCON 3.]

The roguelike movement keys are in no way, shape, or form labeled as
to what direction they move you in, unlike, say, the numpad keys.

Right, you have to read some documentation first. Which you have
to do anyway, if you are going to get anywhere with roguelikes -
in particular Angband.

[snip lots]

Nine less keys to learn, because they work bloody easily, is still a
big improvement in usability. Numpad, numpad, rah rah rah!

For 4 commonly used keys, the placement which gives the most
relaxed use...

Mnemonic use is what concerns me. If I want relaxation I'll sit and
read a book, or go to bed, or something. :)

Seems to me if you use more symbols commonly, then you should actually
have a keyboard with additional keys for those additional symbols,

Quite. 106 keys instead of 104 (and before that 102). Compare
104-key <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Qwerty.svg> with an
old 106-key <http://www.av-senteret.no/nettskolen/kurs/tastatur.jpg>.
Note the narrower Left Shift/Enter keys, making room for '<>' and <*,>.

Hrm. In response, and also to another post in this thread with a
snarky tone, note that if the language uses a significantly different
alphabet than A-Z, the good old QWERTY layout might suck and a whole
new layout, perhaps with more keys but with all the letter keys in the
central area, might make more sense.

Of course then the keyboard is even stranger when it comes to moving
keys like, say, hjkl around (and not just ;); another excellent reason
to use the numpad for movement instead. ;)

Fine, not excessive. But still hand movement. And less relaxed
than necessary, see above. Personally I almost never use the
numpad, and for my most commonly used apps you could also remove
the arrow keys and the keys above them and I wouldn't care.

Your most commonly used apps do not require navigation, or worse,
force mouse use instead of giving you the option? Heck -- your most
common tasks do not include *text editing*?? (For which task home,
end, page up, page down, and delete are invaluable, nevermind arrows,
if you don't want to be constantly reaching for the mouse.)

Though I do appreciate those for apps where I don't know the
keyboard bindings well

Well the bindings for the functions home, end, page up, page down,
delete, move up one, move down one, move left one, and move right one
should be nigh-universal I'd think. If you're using an app that
doesn't bind those functions to the obvious keys, might I suggest
finding an alternative app, preferably one whose designer was
possessed of the faculty of reason? :)

.

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