Re: Weak TZ Flippers.
- From: PinAffliction <s.torpe@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 11:27:31 -0700
each leg to ground, not the best indicator. The differential of 25.5From your test results, it appears you are measuring your ac voltages,
and 28.3 is suspicious too.
Anyway, measure the AC voltage on the Power Driver board (PDB), at
J102, between pins 8 and 5, and again between pins 9 and 6, not to
ground. I don't recall exactly, but this should be something like 50
Vac or a bit higher. There is suppose to be a jumper in the J102
connector between 8 and 9, and again between 5 and 6, to handle the
current demand, this double check will verify it is there and working.
Next measure the AC voltage at the Fliptronics board (FTB), J901
between pins 1 and 3, and again between pins 2 and 5. Here again there
should be a jumper in the connector from pin 1 to pin 2, and pin 3 to
pin 5, to handle the current demand.
The AC voltage you read at J901 should be nearly Identical to what you
saw at J102 of the PDB.
If not, there is resistance in the path through the PDB from J102 to
J104/105 and/or out through the cable to J901 on FTB.
If the AC voltage is the same at both J102 and J901 from your test,
but the DC voltage relative to ground you see on the flippers is a
great deal lower than the pops or slings for instance, then there must
A defect in the bridge rectifier circuit on the FTB, such as an open
leg or high resistance from poor solder. Which is not likely since you
said you swapped the FTB out.
Or there is a load on the FTB output, loading down the supply.
You can isolate all the flippers from the FTB by pulling J907, or try
each of the four flipper fuses F901 - F904,one at a time, if the DC
voltage jumps up close to 70Vdc, after you remove a fuse, there is an
issue with a load on that branch.
On Oct 9, 10:57 pm, necro_nemesis <necro_neme...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Oct 9, 4:13 pm, PinAffliction <s.to...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Frankly, I'm surprised you are not getting flipper resets with that
line voltage.The first connector you mentioned is the connection that
goes to coin door for DBV. I'm disappointed the black and white wires
are swapped, but it is not crucial, just does not match schematics.
(Also, note the power drawings often have some errors relating to this
You can replug the connector at the transformer for low line voltage
Unplug the line cord from wall first.
Move the wire at location 7 to location 4.
Move the jumper in 8&9 to 5&6. (so for easy memory, move 7,8,9 to
4,5,6 for low line, respectively, assuming they are plugged right to
begin with, remembering that 3 of my 14 machines were wired wrong to
This will move the input line voltage to the tap on both primary
windings I mentioned before.
You will most certainly see a boost in lamp brightness and flipper
There will be some who will say this will stress your power supplies,
and that may be only in that they are currently putting out lower
voltages than designed, you need to be the judge.
I will say that I have monitiored the line voltage at my home with a
max/min recording voltmeter, for over a year.
My daily voltage swing was often 108v to 110v on the low side,
averaged 114v, and never went over 121v.
I was having constant issues with flipper resets, and poor flipper
performance. Most of the power supply readings were well below
documented values, lamps were dull and dim.
I replugged all my machines as descrbed for low line voltage, and have
completely eliminated flipper resets, with vastly improved flipper
strength and brighter lamps. For example, there now is absolutely no
issue with making the Ring shots on LOTR.
The 20 volt supply is now 20 instead of 17, the 12 volt logic
regulator actually has enough input voltage to regulate at 12 volts,
G.I. is 6.2 Vac, etc.
I have had one lamp matrix driver transistor fail since replugging,
and cannot say that replugging was the reason, as I was doing some
other mods when it failed.
So you can try this low line adjustment, and see if you like it, but
you should monitor your line voltage so as not to put your machine at
risk by boosting line voltage that is already too high.
On Oct 8, 7:10 pm, necro_nemesis <necro_neme...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Oct 8, 6:40 pm, PinAffliction <s.to...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
With the machine in attract mode your flippers should read almost 70
volts from any coil lug to ground. If not I would suggest digging into
the flipper power supply, likely either a bad leg in a bridge
rectifier, high resistance in connectors, or bad or miswired
transformer windings (more likely).
BTW what is your input voltage from the wall?
Of the 16 pins I recently decided to verify the transformer tap
jumpers, three were wired wrong.
There are essentially two 115 volt transformer primary windings in WPC
transformers and many others. Each of these primary windings also has
a tap about 10% from one end, to allow for line adjustment.
Both windings are put in parallel for 100-120 volt service, they are
put in series for 220-240. The full winding of each is used for the
higher input voltages of each service range (120 or 240), the taps are
used when input voltage is at the lower end of that range (100 or
If the transformer is jumpered incorrectly, you could have incorrect
output voltages, for instance if only one of the two primary windings
is good on a 120 volt configuration, you would see approximately the
correct output voltages with no load, but the maximum current capacity
would be about half, causing the output voltages to sag under load.
The transformer tap configurations are shown in the WPC schematics,
your transformer should be p/n 5610-12835-00.
For 115v operation, the black wire should go to pin 1, while pins 2
and 3 should have a small jumper (preferably black). The white wire
from line input should go to pin 7, and pins 8 and 9 should have a
small jumper (preferably white).
This applies the line voltage across the whole of one primary winding
with the two jumpers putting the second primary in parallel with the
first, doubling the current capacity of the transformer output.
Check your line voltage, these jumper settings and report back.
On Oct 8, 4:06 pm, necro_nemesis <necro_neme...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I measured the voltages at the flippers under load. 42.5 left and 42.3
right. Anyway I pulled the opto boards and reflowed them. The voltage
went up marginally to about 42.8 but that could of been a result of
just about anything (the position of the sun or maybe I farted when
taking the reading). Anyway I thought this voltage is supposed to be
higher. The 50V test point TP6 on the driver board without any
substantial load is showing 63 volts.
As for position of the flippers, they are right on spec to the
alignment holes. The EOS switches do not come into play prematurely
and I am back to scratching my head. What do you guys think of these
readings?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
114.1 volts at the wall
Pin 1 is white, Pin 7 is black pin 3 to 4 are jumpered and so is 5 to
6. But the jumpers are irrelevant since they have nothing on the other
side of the connector to go to. The other side is only the respective
1 and 7 line.
Now further back right at the tranformer there is anouther connector.
It has the same configuration for white and black and has the jumpers
in as you indicated for the 115 volt operation. i.e 2 3 jumped and 8
to 9 jumped. That one actually has a multitude of wire going directly
to the transformer on the other side of the connector, so changing
those would definitely have an effect.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Took more measurements before attempting this.
I am getting a full 10 Volts more from the other coils when not under
load. They read 67 volts and the flippers are all at 57 volts. J 102
pins 5 and 6 feed J 104 Pin 2. J 102 8 and 9 feed J 104 Pin 1. These
are they only power lines to the fliptronic board. Now these same feed
from J 102 go to BR3 which produces the 67 Volts.
Now measuring these two AC inputs yields 25.5 and 28.3 for each feed.
If I measure it going into the driver board, out of the driver board
and going into the fliptronics board the readings are the same. Which
to me tells me two things.
1. BR3 can sufficiently produce 67 volts using this feed.
2. There is apparently no loss in AC voltage through the system up to
the fliptronics board.
So now here is the kicker. If the fliptronics board is not producing
the 67 volts that I think I am trying to achieve, I tried swapping the
board which gave no sign of improvment? Unfortunately I didn't measure
voltages with the swap, but am going on the assumption that the
rectified voltage from BR3 on the driver board should be rather close
to the rectified voltage on the fliptronics board since the input AC
is the same source.
Is that the case? The voltage say at the jet bumpers should be very
close to the flippers? Two different rectifier circuits but I would
think they should be similar and not the 10 Volt spread.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
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