Re: Italian Go - the latest twists


parim(nospam)belli wrote:
Harry Sigerson wrote:
Henric,


It looks like they have sacked him at last.
Let's hope that the Italian goplayers will be able to
do the same.


As I've just posted to Hans, it couldn't be more finely
balanced.
There is on the web page that shows maps with the locations of
Go clubs in lots of the countries of the world. I don't think for a
minute that it is complete; someone's own way of showing the range of
the game. It'll be in the Bookmark list somewhere.
Looking at this for, in our case the European scene, I wondered
who EGF deals with for each country.
We have that great thing the European Union, a coming together
of lots of countries for the common good. The EU still sticks to
entire countries as its building blocks, as it had to; each of their
separate cultures have, over millennia, managed to grow lots of
languages (and laws) all of which have developed in their particular
ways (Chaucer's text is to a great extent a 'foreign' language to
this English speaker - I'd wager there is a Chaucer-like version for
each and every other European language).

(not sure that I'm following the argument very well here...)

No. "Sao ko kelle terre ...", the first short text written in Italian
before the year 1000, does look strange, but it is still understandable
if you know modern Italian.

Placiti cassinesi, interesting. But where do you put the italian
dialects
along with that argument? I would agree that texts by Dante and
Boccaccio, not
to mention later on by Giordano Bruno or Galilei, look pretty modern.
But this is a literary tradition, supposedly it doesn't say so much
about how
people have actually been speaking throughout the centuries. As I
recall it
is often claimed that the italian language was created /made up by
Bembo
et al. around 1600, or even by Manzoni et al. in the 19th century.

What is your answer to the related question: why is it that written
language
and the standard spoken language today correspond so well in e.g.
italian, spanish and german, whereas there is such a spelling mess in
the cases of e.g. english, french and swedish? It has always been a
mystery to me.

For the record: written swedish from the early 14th century is
understandable to a swedish speaking person with no special training,
but not very easily. The spelling, but also the vocabulary and the
grammar are quite different from the modern language. At least 10-20%
of the words have no recognisable counterpart in modern swedish.
Contemporary written norwegian or danish are definitely easier to
understand to a modern swede than 14th century swedish.

There are for sure problems with definitions in this field. As somebody
said: "A language is a dialect with an army and a navy".

Now, let's use France as an example since there are lots of Go
clubs there (I could have cited Deutschland for the same reason).
When the EGF in the course of it's dealings with its 'European'
members, is talking to France, who does it 'speak' to; or to whom
does it speak <s>?

To the French Go Federation, of course.

Is it simply that Internet communication is so quick and so
widespread, all that has to done is band spread its needs to be then
afforded what would be an overwhelming response from all those
hundreds of clubs in France?
Or has the EGF asked the clubs of France to find among
themselves a body of folk with the time, knowledge of the game and
enthusiasm to be an information gathering and disseminating body
dealing with the work of the EGF.
I'd say that last would have to be the case;

Actually, it went the other way round. The Go Associations of some
European countries (Germany, Austria, UK, Yugoslavia and perhaps a few
more) decided sometime around 1960 that having a European Go Federation
was a good idea to coordinate their activities.

Summer 1959, Germany, Austria, UK, Holland and perhaps Yugoslavia,
that's what can be gathered from Franco Pratesis Eurogo, volume 2.

best regards,
Henric

.

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