Re: |[4e] Races and Classes - Class info

Sea Wasp wrote:
tussock wrote:
Sea Wasp wrote:

How, *IN GAME* (not in the real world), do you determine that
"science" isn't "magic"? It's just using specific rituals and
techniques to manipulate powerful forces to get them to produce the
effects you want?

Easy. To be science you just need to be repropducable.

So they're all science, then, as magic in D&D is *deadly*
reproducible. Anyone with the intelligence/force of personality to be a
mage can shoot a fireball after they learn how. It works every time,
unless interfered with. Just like a gun.

Wizards are definately technological, they study their powers at
institutes of higher learning and all. It's a tricky tech, somewhat
unique to the individuals biorythms or somesuch, and extremely hard work.
Archivists do the same for divine magic, IIRC, and Psions for their thing
too.
Other folk can do the same things with *magic*.

Magic is therefore where you have twelve men hold a stick, say a
word, wave their hand, and one guy blows a hole in the target, once or
twice a day, where the other eleven get nothing. A difference in the
basic form of the result using the /same tools/, rather than just in
the chance of success.

But in D&D, this doesn't describe magic.

It describes some parts of it, I think. That the same effects can be
done through technological means doesn't make the original way less
magical.

In D&D, you have 12 men hold a stick. Some can make the stick blow a
hole in the target, some can't, but (A) it's a constant as to which men
can make the stick do its work, (B) men can consistently learn to be
able to make sticks like that, (C) it's possible for those with such
learning to make similar sticks that WILL work for the other eleven men
-- it just takes more effort.

In other words, magic in D&D is exactly as reliable as
technology. It follows DIFFERENT rules, yes, but it follows rules that
are just as firm -- and reliable -- as technology.

Magic items are mostly tech, it's true, though I'd argue some of the
restrictions are at least partly magical. DnD does have a lot of proper
magic too though, Clerics, Druids, Sorcerers, and Warlocks to note the
main ones, it's just that most of their magical abilities can be
reproduced almost exactly with technological means and sufficient study.

The tech is still a bit /weird/ of course; you have to be magical or
have a unique studious copy of magical abilites to make it, and doing so
messes with your head every time.

--
tussock

http://www.alternet.org/columnists/story/60950/?page=entire
.

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