Re: Desert Lizardfolk

Justisaur <justisaur@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Aug 24, 11:32 pm, tussock <sc...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Keith Davies wrote:

<Re: Level Adjustments>

The only thing I find at all worrisome here is the +2 natural
armor, the claws are no big deal. The rest of it looks just fine
(except, as you said, you forgot low-light vision).

WotC always puts +1 on the "2 claws" monsters, because when you
take a strong Rogue you end up averaging 20 damage at 1st level with
a flanking full attack. Corner case, sure, but that's how the LAs are
set.

Huh? How are you getting that high? 3.5 per sneak attack, so that's 7
total, along with your 5 points from your d4 claws is 12. Wotc uses
elite arrays for their playtesting IIRC so at most that would be 15
strength for an extra +2 each for 16. I suppose if you had the option
of a high strength (18) rogue you could get 20 - assuming you hit both
times, are flanking, not fighting undead, etc. Which I don't see all
that often. I think this is one of those 'it works on paper' cases.

I was wondering the same thing, and came up with the same math you did.

I'd never really thought about it, but it does appear claws are a big
advantage for rogues, no having to spend any feats on twf, on the
other hand enchanting your claws is far more difficult/expensive than
getting magic weapons, more of an issue later though.

By the time you can arrange to get your claws enchanted, I suspect
you're facing the loss of iterative attacks -- they don't apply to
natural weapons.

I don't see the claws as a problem.

Now that I see this the Kenku does appear to be under LA'd at 0. 2
claws (1d3), and +4 to hit from flanking (instead of the normal +2)
they do have the -2 str though to keep the combat rogue in check
slightly.

Still 1st level power attacking charging mounted raging orc barbarian
with a lance two handed and max str does 39 points average, and he's
+0 LA

Heh. There's *always* something worse.

Call it +1 LA for Rogues, or have Lizardfolk Rogues drop the first
1d6 sneak attack.

That's way out of the standard rules, I wouldn't feel comfortable
doing that.

If I were worried about it, remove the two claw attacks and make it a
feat to turn them back on (requiring BAB +1). The claws are still
there, but you need to train to use them in combat (I've seen similar
things for bite and tail attacks). Or treat them as real weapons -- you
can claw with one hand normally (with iterative attacks), or use TWF
(with penalties).


Keith
--
Keith Davies "History is made by stupid people
keith.davies@xxxxxxxxxxxx "Clever people wouldn't even try
keith.davies@xxxxxxxxx "If you want a place in the history books
http://www.kjdavies.org/ "Then do something dumb before you die."
-- The Arrogant Worms
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Fighting an Owlbear
    ... Owlbear has two claw attacks and one bite. ... Owlbear claws adventurer A - grapple checks and wins (as it's likely ...
    (rec.games.frp.dnd)
  • Re: Fighting an Owlbear
    ... Owlbear has two claw attacks and one bite. ... Owlbear claws adventurer A - grapple checks and wins (as it's likely ...
    (rec.games.frp.dnd)
  • Re: Fighting an Owlbear
    ... Owlbear has two claw attacks and one bite. ... Owlbear claws adventurer A - grapple checks and wins (as it's likely ...
    (rec.games.frp.dnd)
  • Re: Cat spanking suggestions?
    ... She does get excited and attacks it sometimes, ... She keeps her claws in and only ... Buster definitely uses teeth and claws, although surprisingly, the ... only scratch I have on my arm is from Betty, ...
    (rec.pets.cats.anecdotes)
  • Re: Weapon Speed Question
    ... for Daggers a rogue should have a slower speed. ... I'm sure the person who told you about slower weapons most of been ... attacks such as backstab or sinister strike, ... would also result in your instant attacks hitting for more. ...
    (alt.games.warcraft)