Re: "German" for pilots

On 16 Jun 2006 22:08:58 -0700, "Richard Riley" <rtriley@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:


Martin Hotze wrote:

Why English?

This is easy: IMHO it is one of the easiest languages to learn.

English is considered one of the most difficult languages to learn.



Martin -

Are you insane?

English is a horrible language to learn. English is based in German
(common words) AND Latin (for more complex stuff, dating back to the

A lot of technical terms are in Latin and we have used that naming
convention pretty much since day one.

Norman invasion in 1066 that put French in charge) AND ancient Greek
(for the really complex stuff). It's wonderfully expressive because

We don't really us all that much Greek, but like the Latin it is used
in some naming conventions.

Even Russian is becoming more bastardized with English and Latin
terms.

there are always 50 different ways to say something. It's absorbed a

But much of this variation is expressive meaning transmitted by
inflection in speech. It doesn't translate well to the written word.
IE we have enough trouble trying to communicate directly let alone via
print. Nor do we really have 50 different ways of saying something.
Five to ten is quite enough plus we have a language loaded with
synonym and homonyms.

half dozen other languages, the gramatic and spelling rules are full of

Bits and pieces, not the languages them selves. OTOH you see the same
thing in French, German, Italian, Russian, and even Japanese. If you
want a language with variations and learning confusion try Japanese.
It's a language loaded with honorifics, and status applications. Word
"pitch" can denote different things such as bridge and pencil. They
use the same word for both bridge and pencil, but "pitch" denotes
which and pitch is not the same as infliction.

It is a language, described to me by a native Japanese as devoid of
spoken emphasis. Prefixes and suffixes determine whether asking a
question of making a statement. A single element "no" determines
possession, but not quite in the sense we use possession. It's more
like a connection. Quite a few words depend on their use and
placement in a sentence to determine meaning. There are few words
that directly translate to either the romance languages (Latin based
such as French and Spanish), or any other language. You end up
translating concepts, or ideas into phrases in the other language. The
syntax is also different.

Using phonetic spelling. Nehong go ga skosi wakari muth. Translates
*almost* directly into English as: Nehong go (Japanese [the language])
skosi (a little) wakari muth (I understand), or "Japanese, a little I
understand". Sound like Yoda? It's also said with no emphasis. Using
emphasis on words is a sure sign it is not your native tongue.
BTW, wakari muth means "I understand" while wakari mathem is "I don't
understand" and wakari muth ka is asking, "Do you understand?"

On top of that they use three different writing systems which have, I
believe, over a 1000 characters each. We have 24 plus numbers and
punctuation.

exceptions. The vocabulary is gawdawful huge. You have to have 10,000
words to barely get by. In Spanish or Russian or Japanese you can get
around with a quarter of that.

English as in American English and not English, English has been badly
bastardized. It is still considered a Germanic language, but as you
say it has absorbed much from many languages although it has not
absorbed any other language per se.

However, "conversational English" which is a long way from what we see
on here, according to my college professor, only contains about 120
words and you can go to quite a depth with 200. Beyond that words
"flesh out" the meaning. With 120 words there is a tremendous number
of combinations available to convey meaning.

Much, or many of the grammatical and spelling rules have changed in
just the last half century. I graduated from high school in 58.
Spelling and use has changed quite a bit since then. In the 50's we
still used a lot of the English, English (King's English) and even
spelled color as colour.

English is listed as one of the more, if not most difficult languages
to learn as a non-native language. I'd not place Japanese, or Chinese
far behind. Spanish is relatively easy with most being directly
translatable word to word. If you have learned Latin or even have a
basic knowledge of Latin then French and particularly Spanish should
come easy.

I know almost zip about Russian.

It is now the international language of business, so there are a lot of
people learning it, and the more people who learn it the more powerful

Many new technical terms are now English which makes it almost a
necessity And it is becoming universal by default.

it will become. For 2000 years the Chinese have tried to get all their
population to speak the same language. They've always failed. Now

However there is a good reason for that failure. High density
population areas that are wide spread, isolated, and with a rich
cultural heritage.

Even Japanese have some pretty heavy dialects from some areas. OTOH I
have never been able to understand any one from south of the Mason
Dixon Line<:-)) That you may translate as you wish.

they require every school child to take English class every year
they're in school. Between China, India, the US and the former BE, 2/3
of the world will be speaking English in another generation.

I think it's already pretty close to that now and maybe we should do
the same.

If I were going to pick a specific learning difficulty between the
oriental and western languages it'd most likely be pronunciation
rather than the lack of direct translation.

Not because it's better, and certainly not because it's easier. Just
because it's the standard. Like VHS and the qwertyuiop keyboard.

Pretty much like VHS it's because more copies have been sold>:-))

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
.