Re: OT - Mad Men

On Aug 21, 2:08 pm, Shirl <shinn...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dana Carpender:

It was the lack of alternatives.  And sometimes, I think, the lack of
adult contact -- as Peg Bracken once said, little children, no matter
how well-beloved, are notoriously poor conversationalists.

I agree with this, and that was the cause of some relationship "bumps
in the road" for some couples. Mom's home all day with the kids
talking "baby talk"; when Dad comes home from work, Mom can't WAIT to
talk with another adult and *attacks* him with conversation the minute
he walks in the door. But Dad just wants to sit down, take his shoes
off and have some quiet time to unwind *first*, so he's unresponsive,
and Mom takes offense and starts to feel neglected, like he isn't
happy to be home or to see her, and the whole thing snowballs into
something HUGE when all it was, to begin with, was Dad needing a
LITTLE time to himself when he first gets home, and Mom being a LITTLE
more patient about that.





And Shirl, I think staying at home with little kids is great, if you
can, though if a woman's got a career that's really meaningful to her,
rather than what I call a "just-a-job," I can certainly see her wanting
to keep her hand in, rather than permanently relegating herself to
second-class status on the job.  But I strongly feel that as soon as the
last one is in school, it's time for Mom to find another big interest,
whether it's a career, or serious volunteer work, or going back to
school herself.  I hang out at a website for people -- mostly women --
who have problematic relationships with their mothers-in-law, and it's
very clear that in a lot of cases the big problem is that the MIL has
never done anything in her life that was really interesting or
compelling or made her feel important but being "Mommy," and she's
totally unwilling to give up that role, to the point of clinging
desperately to her adult children, or trying to take over the raising of
the grandchildren from her daughter-in-law.  It's sad, but it's also
pathological, and a lot of these women wind up cut off from their grown
children and grandchildren because they become such invasive pests.

There's not a two year old in the world who doesn't want to be the
center of Mommy's universe.  There's not a thirty year old in the world
who doesn't resent the hell out of it.  Somewhere in between, "Mommy"
needs to find another identity.

My mother was a genius at this; she was a stay-at-home-mom when I was
little -- class mother, Girl Scout leader, the whole nine yards.  Then
she got two masters degrees, and a career she loved, and an active
professional and social life, and while she was always happy to see us,
she was never intrusive or needy or clingy -- with the result that all
of us were happy to see her and include her in our lives.

I agree with all of that, Dana. Thing is, there are obsessive moms who
won't let go *with and without* other, outside careers, though I'm
sure it's more prevalent with stay-at-home moms (i.e., Mary Williams
who was, I'm SURE, a character based on MY mother-in-law!! eeeesh!).

I'm not saying women shouldn't have other interests or even part-time
work when the kids are growing up. I couldn't agree more with that. I
had home-office while mine were growing up -- I took them to and from
school myself, and I was able to work while they were in school and go
on their field trips, etc. It wasn't always a perfect arrangement --
there *are* drawbacks to working at home, too! -- but it allowed me to
raise my own instead of putting them in day care and still contribute
to the family income. And it wasn't "just work" for me, either as I
enjoyed the creative aspect of the writing and graphic design/layout
tasks. I also taught figure skating part time a couple of nights/week
-- that gave ME time to do something I was passionate about and
interact with other children *and adults* as well as keep a hand in
the outside work force, and it also gave my husband one-on-one time
with the kids. Again, not perfect all the time, but WE raised them and
also had time to do some "our own thing" and didn't feel like our
heads were in a noose with kids as some "stay-at-home" parents do.

The thing I was objecting to here is the implication that the life
Diva described (sans the player husband) was/is something for anyone
to look down their nose at or consider insignificant in comparison to
today's women with booming careers and 6-figure salaries.

Shirl

It wasn't looking down noses. I was college educated, hungry for
conversation and intellectual stimulation and it was all as Dana
described it.

Diva
.

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