Re: Thoughts on the Foundation series...

On 3 Aug., 03:29, "Martha Adams" <mh...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"Tue Sorensen" <sorenson...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:8f3b83b2-b771-4f9b-a3e3-afb8d5fe1f21@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
I have just been rereading the Foundation books, and one question that
still remains after having finished "Foundation and Earth" is: WHY is
it so important to keep Earth (and its radioactivity) secret to the
citizens of the Galactic Empire? I don't believe we get an answer. We
hear that the robots have been deleting references to Earth in the
various galactic archives, but it is never clear why. Can anyone offer
any speculation, or justification?

Actually, now that I glance over the last pages again, it seems
(although it isn't directly stated) that the reason for Earth's
secrecy is simply that the robots have their HQ on the moon and must
not be found. This is a rather inadequate reason, I feel, for the
robots could (and probably do) have bases anywhere in the galaxy that
they wish. And if they remain on the moon to somehow guard Earth
against discovery, we again have the question: Why? Is it all just
Daneel's nostalgia and guilt...?

I would have thought that, as the Second Galactic Empire approached,
the robots would be gradually *revealing* their secret knowledge to
humanity.

- Tue Sorensen

Well, it's not that simple. I see two basic points
of view for answering this question (and I can think
of others).

Seems to me, you're writing from a within-the-story
point of view. Taking it as a reality, which is usual
practice. (At least, for me.) My response on this
level is that "We just don't know" is also a plausible
explanation for what goes on there.

True. And I have no objection to that (as Asimov is dead, any chance
of having such questions authoritatively answered lies with the
potential efforts of other writers sanctioned by the Asimov Estate -
and they might then tell us what we didn't know from the original
works, and hopefully their ideas will be good ones), except that it
very strongly seems like we should have gotten a proper answer at the
end of "Foundation and Earth". But "we just don't know" is also OK, as
it frees us to make our own suppositions.

But also, I incline to not to question too deeply into
a story. It interferes with the enjoyment of it.

For some, I think, such questioning rather holds the promise of
intensifying the enjoyment of the story, hoping to see its internal
logic greatly improved.

And another point of view, is that of the *writer*.
With Asimov, that's complex; because along with Asimov
writing the Foundation stories, was John Campbell
commenting on these and even suggesting directions for
things to go. For example, my understanding of where
the Mule came from as the work was in writing, was
that Campbell said, Asimov, you need a new direction
here. How about....

Sure, but I *am* trying to see things from a within-the-story point of
view. That's what I'm interested in. Where the ideas came from in the
real world doesn't interest me as much - in this case, at this time
(always good to include caveats...).

But the overall story is very complex on paper and
more complex in the writer's mind, since the writer
has to make all the choices and constructions that
become the story. Now when at a later point he throws
in a change, it's just not practical to check back and
adjust all the little details in the past story to
accurately fit its current part in writing.

Not practical? The whole idea is to make it fit, so I would think it
was pretty darn *imperative*! I would greatly have welcomed
"remastered" authorial versions of the original trilogy with robot
scenes inserted, and satisfying explanations for just how and why the
robots created the Galactic Empire...

So from those two points of view, I'd rather just
read and enjoy the stories for what is in them, and
not to run off too far with examination. I was young
and much simpler in my mind, when Asimov was doing
the Foundation stories into Astounding and I was
haunting the newsstand to get them as near as
possible to the minute they were on the rack. It is
a good memory today. And I think too much examination,
kills it.

Well, then, perhaps, you should not read my response to your post
(!)... I think it is legitimate to complain about plot holes or
inconsistencies. Quality writing shouldn't have these in significant
amounts. But of course, quality tends to be (perceived as) subjective,
and different people enjoy different things to different degrees, and
at different times and ages. If we're not interested in the same
questions or points, then we don't have much to discuss (in this case,
at this time!)... :-)

- Tue
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Thoughts on the Foundation series...
    ... still remains after having finished "Foundation and Earth" is: ... secrecy is simply that the robots have their HQ on the moon and must ... you're writing from a within-the-story ... With Asimov, that's complex; because along with Asimov ...
    (rec.arts.sf.written)
  • Re: Worst SF/F book youve read
    ... I think robots are far more efficient. ... and transmitting the results back to Earth. ... about stripmining asteroids, planetoids, moons and planets. ... > If we want to increase energy use more than that, ...
    (rec.arts.sf.written)
  • Re: We choose to go to the moon
    ... place and the surface of the moon is even worse. ... The telemetry it sends back to Earth can be used to decide on the best course of action - that is pretty much how it is done today. ... Using robots to work in hostile environments where we cannot function is standard practice on Earth. ... On the surface of Mars you need decent sensors and telemetry. ...
    (sci.astro.amateur)
  • Re: Sickening Discussion
    ... I never said that robots can replace the human or spirit. ... programs of research; astronauts operate the instruments". ... WE back on Earth want that data. ... for projectiles to travel between Earth & most of the other planets. ...
    (sci.space.history)
  • Re: forests on orbit
    ... All this talk of robots does not mean that we need robots at Ceres to ... raw materials in the form of ores and ices are returned to Earth orbit ... The space stations where this occurs will grow in size as costs per ...
    (sci.space.policy)
Loading