Re: Constructive Laziness (Re: Stirling's _The Sunrise Lands_ and misc thoughts)

On 10 Oct 2007 20:57:35 -0400, "Keith F. Lynch" <kfl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

Vegard Valberg <vvalberg@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
So the real question is this: How is the World of Mind changed?

I agree.

S.M. Stirling says that the world of mind is altered so the
scientific method is mainly lost, and the very idea of progress is
gone. If that is so then you're stuck, you're down in a hole and
there's no getting out!

I'm very skeptical that it would be lost. Especially since it would
have to be lost in *everyone*. Either that or those few in whom it
isn't lost would have to be systematically massacred (for heresy or
whatever) by those in power.

What's more, the author *does* depict people trying things to see what
would work. He doesn't depict anyone saying, "We'd better not make
balloons or gliders, or use hydraulics, lest the ASBs smite us."

There is one big argument in favour of SM Stirlings idea, and it
requires that you understand the foundation of science: The idea
that the universe is built on immutable laws, that our senses can
give us true information about the universe, and that our reason can
understand the laws of nature. That we can, to borrow a phrase,
read the mind of God.

The unchanging laws of nature just changed, big time, in a way that
none of our scientific theories can make sense of. The various
changes just don't make sense! Why is electricity not working when
the magnets DO work? Why can we still think, why do our brains
still work? None of this makes sense, none of this can be fully
reconciled with our scientific knowledge, it contradicts everything
we know.

Some people would say, "Screw it," and lie down and die. I would
attempt to investigate the new rules. Okay, nothing of mine that's
electrical works. Cars are all stalled in the road. EMP pulse? But
how could that fry my flashlight? Or cause a nine-volt battery to not
tingle my tongue when I taste it? An EMP pulse *that* strong would
have killed me. And would have caused all the overhead power lines
and phone lines to melt, but they're still there, apparently undamaged.

My compass still points north.

I think that you have a slightly exaggerated idea of how normal humans
work. Do a quick survey at your job and see how many of them happen
to have a compass in their house. I don't (except for a cheap freebie
that doesn't reliably point north). Now, I do remember that I can
make one by rubbing a magnet along a needle long enough and floating
it in a bowl of water, but I'm not sure how many people remember that
from school. And I don't know how many people have magnets at their
houses (possibly more than I imagine, because of refrigerators.)

Then, of the people who have magnets, how many know that you can
create electricity in a wire by using a magnet? Probably only the
ones who happen to be in the electrical fields.

Most people's approach to electricity is "I flip a switch, and the
light comes on", and "Do not mix with water". Ask them how the
electricity gets from the switch to the light, and you will not get
anything more specific than "along the wire". Conductivity is not a
word that is likely to be used.

Rebecca
.

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