Re: "Sleeping in Light" - Ten years ago

On Fri, 21 Nov 2008 23:29:09 GMT, Amy Guskin <aisling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Fri, 21 Nov 2008 17:26:34 -0500, thus spake Mike Ross (in article
<pacei4phnsous2drd036rj4d7k293sflh2@xxxxxxx>):

<snipped to get to the point and avoid repetition>

No, it wasn't. From the relevant UK law...

"...domestic use of a recording of a broadcast solely for the purpose of
enabling it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time does not
infringe any right conferred by Part 2 in relation to a performance or
recording
included in the broadcast." <<

You are still missing the point. The passage, when referring to "a
broadcast," is referring to one that has legally taken place in the UK (being
UK copyright law).

No it doesn't. Nowhere does it refer to where the broadcast took place. You
pulled that out of a hat. If the law meant 'broadcasts made in the UK' it would
have said so. It doesn't, probably because TV signals (and especially satellite
TV signals) from so many different European countries are available in the UK.

The law in the UK (as is pretty clear above) is concerned with the *use* of the
recording. Was it domestic use? Yes. Then it's specifically decreed, by the law
I've cited above, to be non-infringing. I don't know why you're having trouble
with that concept; perhaps the law as pertains to home recordings is subtly
different in the US? I'm not sure it's ever been fully legislated or litigated;
'Betamax' only dealt with the concept of contributory infringement by a device
manufacturer, it specifically did NOT get involved with the individual
home-taper. I'm not sure the 'right' of an individual to timeshift without
infringing was ever actually decided in US law. I believe there are cases in
litigation right now to do with server-based PVRs which might throw some light.

(To digress, it's not even an offence to simply possess or watch an undoubted
'pirate' DVD, bought off the street, in the UK; it's only an offence to possess
it *in the course of a business*.)

The person who taped it in the US and sent it off to the
UK _distributed_ it without benefit of permission from the copyright owner,
who had the sole right to decide when to air the UK premiere of that
particular program.

Yes, because domestic use isn't a 'UK premiere' and doesn't *need* the
permission of the copyright holder! Do you really think a wife giving a home
recording to her husband consitutes 'distribution'? Would it have been any
different if she had brought it over and watched it with me?

Nope. Because it wasn't legal in the US for that person to have distributed
the tape as he/she did. So what you acquired wasn't legal content to begin
with, and thus isn't covered by UK copyright law.

Read again what I said above; I don't accept your declaration of illegality
there. In any case, UK law isn't so much concerned with the legality of the
*content* (in a private domestic setting) as it is with the *use* of the
material. If it's private domestic use it's non-infringing.

<snip redundant duplication>

I'm sorry if I've come off as unpleasant -- I really haven't meant to (and I
suppose your "<sighs>" above was pleasant?).

The sigh was intended to convey slight exasperation with someone who was
pronouncing on UK copyright law, apparently without having first taken the
trouble to get acquainted with it! :-)

I'm just quite sure of my
information being correct. And I don't need to cite the law because it's one
of the most basic tenets of it.

Ummm... translation: 'I'm right and you're wrong'?

Just to give you an example that
you might understand better, let's say that I went in to see "Changeling" on
the day it opened in the US, and I had a camcorder with me. I taped it. I
sent it off to you in the UK, where the movie has not yet opened. And you
had a few friends over to watch it in your living room. Do you think that
that qualifies as a permissible use under UK copyright law?

I can't speak for the totality of what you describe. I'm 100% certain that the
cinema taping is specifically outlawed in the USA. I'm equally certain that the
tape would be legal to *privately* possess or view in the UK; remember what I
said about the pirate DVD. That comes from the Copyright, Designs & Patents Act
1988; go and read it if you don't believe me. Equally, if I sold, uploaded, or
publically showed - basically did anything outside the home, or by way of
business - the tape, that *would* be illegal in the UK.

Mike
--
http://www.corestore.org
'As I walk along these shores
I am the history within'

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: REQ: Please Repost Confidential 1 & 2
    ... copyright law so they can pretend they're not breaking the law. ... The making for private and domestic use of a recording of a broadcast or cable programme solely for the purpose of enabling it to be viewed ... Any recording made for the purposes of time-shifting on a not for profit basis which is what is meant by, for private and domestic use, is totally legal, irrespective of who makes it or how many similar copies are distributed. ...
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  • Re: REQ: Please Repost Confidential 1 & 2
    ... copyright law so they can pretend they're not breaking the law. ... The making for private and domestic use of a recording of a broadcast or cable programme solely for the purpose of enabling it to be viewed ...
    (rec.arts.drwho)
  • Re: REQ: Please Repost Confidential 1 & 2
    ... copyright law so they can pretend they're not breaking the law. ... The making for private and domestic use of a recording of a broadcast or cable programme solely for the purpose of enabling it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time does not infringe any copyright in the broadcast or cable programme or in any work included in it." ...
    (rec.arts.drwho)
  • Re: REQ: Please Repost Confidential 1 & 2
    ... copyright law so they can pretend they're not breaking the law. ... The making for private and domestic use of a recording of a broadcast or cable programme solely for the purpose of enabling it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time does not infringe any copyright in the broadcast or cable programme or in any work included in it." ...
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