Re: Effects of Magic

Helen Hall <usenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

In message <0csac4lj71dg5ra5j11u6e7lal4cgjrekj@xxxxxxx>, Alma Hromic
Deckert <anghara@xxxxxxxxx> writes
On Mon, 08 Sep 2008 11:10:47 -0700, David Friedman
<ddfr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

In article
<1imtfya.14bg7ha1bpj2g9N%green_knight@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
green_knight@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Catja Pafort) wrote:

What I did not see at all was the wish to keep it secret, the fear that
she has said too much, the ringing with herself whether she should trust
this new acquaintance or not. And you haven't shown anywhere near enough
of Mari being friendly, being trustworthy, being a friend to make me
believe that Ellen _would_ trust her.

---
"I think Coelus figured it out from basic magical theory, but I'm not
sure and explaining it would be hard, since you haven't taken those
classes yet. How do I know ??"

She gave the other girl a long, considering look. "How good are you at
keeping secrets?"

"Very good, when I want to. My brother tells me all about ? things he
does. I never tell our parents." She stopped.

"Can you keep a secret for me too?"

Mari nodded. Ellen turned in her seat, holding her hand, palm up, where
her body blocked it from the rest of the room. For a moment her hand
cupped a flame. "That's how I know."
---

Perhaps that isn't strong enough, but it does, I think, make it clear
that she is hesitant about whether or not to reveal her talent to Mari.

Nuh-uh. Not strong enough at all. Again, how well do these two know
each other?

"Can you keep a secret?" is something that a couple of five-year-olds
might say to each other, probably about trivial things that mean
nothing if the secret isn't kept. But a simple "YEAH! Sure! I can keep
a secret! My brother tells me things I don't tell our parents!" is FAR
from enough for me to accept that someone would take that as weighty
enough to reveal a real secret, one that might carry real
consequences.

It's not believable to me either, I'm afraid. If being a fire mage is a
big deal, Ellen shouldn't be telling people she's only just met, people
she has no idea whether she can trust. It makes the scene inwardly
inconsistent. You say it's terribly important that it's kept secret,
then she blabs to the first person she has a proper conversation with.

It's believable to me for three reasons:

(a) Some people *are* good judges of character. I don't tell secrets to
people who aren't trustworthy. But I might to someone who is
trustworthy. And, yes, I can tell. Or I believe I can, which is what
matters here. I can believe that, if Mari *can* be trusted, that Ellen
could trust her, if she trusts her own judgement about Mari. (Which she
will, if she is confident.)

(b) Over the years, a number of people have confided in me about various
things. No, I'm not going to say what. They are secrets. I've never
repeated them to anybody, and I'm not going to. (I've been tempted a few
times though... <g>)

(c) Ellen (as is clear in the excerpt) welcomes the idea of a friend who
isn't going to stare at her tits or be appraising her intellectual
abilities all the time. Loneliness is a powerful motivator: she may
*need* (or at least want) a friend.

Yes, I know that the only way to keep a secret is to kill anyone you
tell it to... but that is, actually, even in the real world, an
exaggeration.

Jonathan

--
Jonathan L Cunningham
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Effects of Magic
    ... believe that Ellen _would_ trust her. ... Mari nodded. ... that's not a reason to keep a secret. ... After all, she can expect some degree of bullying for being poor, rural, ...
    (rec.arts.sf.composition)
  • Re: Effects of Magic
    ... believe that Ellen _would_ trust her. ... "Can you keep a secret for me too?" ... Mari nodded. ... If being a fire mage is a big deal, Ellen shouldn't be telling people she's only just met, people she has no idea whether she can trust. ...
    (rec.arts.sf.composition)
  • Re: Hypocrit
    ... Yau-Man should have pointed out that Alex ... "It's one thing to keep a secret advantage a secret. ... trust by searching through people's personal and private belongings ... trust Alex, but we have seen your true character shine through by your ...
    (alt.tv.survivor)
  • Re: Dumbledore asked Snape to kill him
    ... As I understand Felix, ... what happens when a Secret Keeper dies: the secret dies with him, ... to be safe, he would chose (as Secret Keeper), some useless soul like ... No need to trust anyone... ...
    (alt.fan.harry-potter)
  • Re: Effects of Magic
    ... I don't think Ellen's trust is ... no reason to trust Mari with an important secret. ... And not when the reader has just ...
    (rec.arts.sf.composition)
Loading