Re: First round of descriptive/external exercises

"Catja Pafort" <usenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1h4nhgn.1fg3nplcalxb6N%usenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Patricia C. Wrede <pwrede6492@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> "Catja Pafort" <usenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>>
>> > Patricia C. Wrede <pwrede6492@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>>

>> > Interesting. I've got Steering the Craft, and I've read it a couple of
>> > times, but _in isolation_ that exercise made no sense to me at all.
>> > It's
>> > having a _context_ for it, and a *reason* as well as coming at the
>> > right
>> > time that made iit into a very valuable tool indeed.
>>
>> She gives the reasons in the book; I think you just weren't ready to see
>> them. Or possibly the way she phrased it wasn't something that got it
>> across for you; that happens, sometimes.
>
> I have to say I looked at most of the book thinking 'and this is it'?
> There was no 'wow' moment involved anywhere at all. It just did not
> click.

Did you actually try to do any of the exercises, or did you just read
through them and think "what's the point?" Because doing the exercises was
really, for me, the main thing -- being *told* that something is important
or interesting or has certain effects just doesn't have the same impact, for
me, as actually trying to make it work in my own prose, even if it's only
for a couple of paragraphs. Like the no-adjectives thing.

>
>
>> >> When you are describing a place in a story, your *character* is
>> >> walking
>> >> around in it/listening to it/looking at it. What he sees and hears
>> >> and
>> >> feels -- all the outside input -- is what you have for your
>> >> descriptions.
>> >
>> > Only the damn bastards won't shut up trying to tell me all about their
>> > lovelives (dreams, hopes, what they ate laste night...)
>>
>> They can *tell* you all they want. You don't have to write it down. Or,
>> if
>> you have to write it down to get them to shut up, you don't have to end
>> up
>> putting it in the book.
>
> I think I need to squash it from the get-go if I want to get anywhere.

If you do, then you do.

>> OK, what do you think *would* work?
>
> 'Show, don't tell.' (I've explained it in a post answering Helen's).

Yep, that'd do it.

> And, ahem, slowing down, and doing this thing about casting about for
> another way of expressing something, particularly when the first thing
> is an [often internal] summary. So
>
> "As Vegren moved closer towards him, Geflan had the strong impression
> that Emprith was trying to warn him."
>
> becomes
>
> "As if sensing his inner turmoil, Vegren sidled even closer.
> Behind them, Emprith began to whistle under his breath, a queer, thin,
> slightly out-of-tune whistling that forced Geflan to listen intently for
> a moment before he recognised it, and then it was all he could do not to
> laugh aloud. 'Sweet Nephys lured a soldier boy' was more than a good
> tune to march to or the obvious warning; it was a favorite of all of
> Geflan's family. He was certain that he had never whistled it in
> Emprith's company, which left Kaleia as the culprit."

Oh, that's *very* nice.

> We were both right, by the way. You because I needed to *slow down* to
> write that, and me because I can't do it in my head, and I can't do it
> with pen and paper, I need to be sitting at the computer to get to that
> level of writing.

If you do, then you do. I think it's at least possible that you could learn
to do it by hand, or even in your head, but one thing at a time is more than
enough to try to deal with. So my next question is -- can you do it *when
you transcribe your day's hand-writing onto the computer*?

> Branching out is a good mental 'picture' for me to hold, more like
> spreading out roots, casting about sideways for something nutritious and
> stabilising.

I like that metaphor, too.

>> Oh, I'm not saying you ought to have tried to do it all at once. How you
>> got
>> to this point is over and done with. I brought it up mainly as a
>> reminder
>> that, rolling forward, it's likely to be difficult to retrain all those
>> habits, so you shouldn't get discouraged if, gosh, it turns out to be
>> difficult.
>
> Have no fear. I'm far too thoroughly hooked to be discouraged at this
> stage.

Well, good. I personally find learning new skills to be immensely
gratifying, even if they're terribly hard and I grouse about them constantly
on the way to learning them. They're *especially* gratifying when they were
miserably hard to do -- that's why I keep bringing up my second novel, where
I learned to to tight-third, and also the one where I had to do the
phrase-by-phrase trimming.

>> > Now that I've proven I can come up with novel-length ideas and maintain
>> > them, and come up with interesting setting and characters and story
>> > etc,
>> > I'm a lot readier for it.
>>
>> And you know that you can succeed with some aspects of writing, which
>> means
>> that very likely you can learn the others. Confidence is a wonderful
>> thing.
>
> It is a habit, I suppose, as much as anything else. I had a time in my
> life where people very successfully tried to take the confidence out of
> me. I don't ever want to go there again.

Well, to heck with them. Success is the best revenge. There's nothing
quite like the lovely gloating feeling you get from contemplating the
complete jerk who, twenty years back, said, "Your stuff is awful; it'll
never sell. You should give up now and get a job at K-Mart instead of
wasting your time on this junk" when you have fifteen years of successful
sales under your belt. Especially when *they* are still trying to finish
the same Really Brilliant Great American/British Novel they were working on
when they made this lofty pronouncement...or better yet, have finished but
not sold a whole bunch of things, while still living in their mother's
basement. You can get a nice, warm, fuzzy glow for *days* just from
thinking about it, even if you are an extremely nice person who would never,
ever say anything that would even *imply* to this person that you remembered
and were gloating over their injudicious comments. (Especially since your
friends will do that part for you.)

> (Have I mentioned lately what a fantastic teacher you are? I cannot
> thank you enough for the time and effort you are investing)

As I said to David, it's the closest thing I can get to making my backbrain
hold an advanced writing course for *me*. In this regard, I respond to
outside stimuli -- I'm not very good at poking my backbrain in order to
figure out what it's doing just so *I* can understand it; it resists,
because hey, it's doing it's job, why do I need to know more? But if I have
to explain to somebody *else*, that's different. Questions are good.
Especially if they're from people like you and Rosemary, who *think*
differently, and for whom I have to pay very close attention and really dig
in order to come up with the bit that's actually going to be helpful to you.
So you're welcome...and thank *you*.

Patricia C. Wrede


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