Re: OT: Ben Stein's Expelled

On Nov 10, 3:48 pm, Howard Duck <hbd...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Nov 2008 16:53:35 -0600, "Stanley Moore"



<smoor...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Changes due to environment still require a randomness of selection.

Not at all. Mutations that cause changes ARE random. Caused perhaps by
radioactive decay (almost everything including our bodies are radioactive to
some extent [background radiation]). There are other causes, ultraviolet
rays from the sun, chemical influences etc. The mutations occur randomly,
unpredictably, and the cause changes in the way an organism works. Because
they are random they can be detrimental, neutral, or beneficial to the
organism they happen to.  Most of the time these changes are detrimental and
the organism involved dies, or fails to find a mate or is never born at all.
Things like albinism are random and most albinos do not survive long, one
reason they are rare. They usually do not see well, they stand out in a
darker colored environment are thus are easier prey, they are more easily
damaged by sunlight.

But sometimes rarely a mutation confers some benefit, making the organism
more fitted to its environment, making it more attractive to the opposite
sex and therefore making it reproduce more and pass this trait to its
descendents. I read somewhere that a mutation that increases reproductive
success just 1% will be found in more than half of individuals in just 10
generations. I am just guessin for this example but polar bears are just
brown bears that gradually adapted to their environment by getting lighter
and lighter ending up white, probably because lighter bears could sneak up
on seals easier and therefore mated more successfully.

The point is that mutations are random. Random in time, random in cause,
random in effect. What is not random is the selection part. It's NOT random
that the albino gets eaten quicker by its predators. It is easier to find.
It's not random that being born blind makes it harder to eat or find a mate.
Yet animals living in caves are almost always blind becaue eyes do not
confer a benefit.

I think most people acknowledge this.

In any case if you look at the biological world you do not see much if any
evidence of design, much less good intelligent design. One example is
parasitism. No deity setting out to design something would set up parasites.
One of my favorite contra examples to divine design is the parasitic wasps
http://insects.tamu.edu/fieldguide/cimg329.html. These nice creatures lay
eggs in other species caterpillars and they hatch and feed on the body of
the living worm, then hatch, eat through the skin and it dies. The
creepiness of this behavior is evidence of a non benevolent deity. Anyway
randomness lies in mutations not in selection which is definitely not random
but highly dependent on the environment in which the animal lives. Take care

What does the following statement mean to you?

Luke 10:19  Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and
scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by
any means hurt you.

What enemy?

What about this?

Mat 13:27  So the servants of the householder came and said unto him,
Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath
it tares?
Mat 13:28  He said unto them, An enemy hath done this.

What enemy sowed "tares" in the field (the world)?  They look like
ordinary people (wheat), but they aren't.
--
Howard

Speaking of serpents and scorpions, sting ray wrestlers, and NASCAR
and Indy drivers, they are the most prime examples of the Darwinians
amongst us.
Barry
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT: Ben Steins Expelled
    ... and the cause changes in the way an organism works. ... darker colored environment are thus are easier prey, ... evidence of design, ... and over all the power of the enemy: ...
    (rec.arts.mystery)
  • Re: OT: Ben Steins Expelled
    ... rays from the sun, chemical influences etc. ... and the cause changes in the way an organism works. ... darker colored environment are thus are easier prey, ... evidence of design, ...
    (rec.arts.mystery)
  • Re: OT: Ben Steins Expelled
    ... Mutations that cause changes ARE random. ... darker colored environment are thus are easier prey, ... evidence of design, ... and over all the power of the enemy: ...
    (rec.arts.mystery)
  • Re: OT: Ben Steins Expelled
    ... The mutations occur randomly, unpredictably, and the cause changes in the way an organism works. ... But sometimes rarely a mutation confers some benefit, making the organism more fitted to its environment, making it more attractive to the opposite sex and therefore making it reproduce more and pass this trait to its descendents. ... evidence of design, ... and over all the power of the enemy: ...
    (rec.arts.mystery)
  • Re: should space shuttle be cancelled?
    ... So it was the environment of the cold ocean is ... And had an aircraft wing suffered the same damage, ... solved in the design. ... NASA is just being crazy. ...
    (sci.space.policy)