Re: Multi-track rates, revisited

Hey Oleg-

What was the last show you did in Hollywood, my friend? I just got home
from my last one on December 24th. Don't progosticate like you know "the
biz" inside and out. There are lots of players; some do better than others
but the guys who give it away are pissing in the soup. I don't like pissy
soup and I don't respect the people that piss in mine.

D.


"Oleg Kaizerman" <kaizero1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:43b4f6e7$0$40791$892e7fe2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Doug ,you just need to change the attitude , you buy gear for profit - you
> have to deal with how much you want get back and how fast you want return
> the investment - if they expect get 8 radios( lets say you bring 2000$
> average units , not zaxcom) and deva per day on weekly bases , everything
> above 200 a day inside your package is better investment then the bank
> ,much better then the bank:-).and if you expect more you are wrong ,you
> will not get it .
> the producer and every other soundman know the bottom line where the gear
> start to be money loose situation . .the big names usually do more on
> their gear because their name ,the upm pay them as a benefit to their"
> talent" not because their gear is justify the price( very common with dps
> which bring their camera and lenses)
> .
>
> eventually you are not working for your gear , the gear is another income
> and when it becomes opposite , just don't own it .
>
> --
> Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
>
> "Douglas Tourtelot" <tourtelot@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:BpydnXI_DdY_WCnenZ2dnUVZ_vudnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> John-
>>
>> Are you saying that a UPM expects 8 tracks of non-linear files and the
>> eight RF mic systems for the same cost as a DAT and 2 Vegas. They will
>> not get that from me, and will have to hire elsewhere if they expect it.
>> Somebody will give it to them too, but it won't be me. I continue to
>> expect some semblance of equity for the product I provide. Don't want to
>> pay for multi-track, non-linear, I'll leave it on the truck and you get a
>> lovely DAT.
>>
>> D.
>>
>> "John Coffey" <coffeyman@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>> news:28477-43B4B198-206@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Doug:
>>>
>>> I know. I hear this every time I sell a new recorder these days. I
>>> feel for you because it costs a lot to re-tool.
>>>
>>> The fact is that most of the early users usually wound up making a
>>> killing on their recorders and paid for it a few times over by the time
>>> it became the "norm" and the specials deals they made, ceased.
>>>
>>> I can cite example after example, going back to the first users of TC
>>> Nagras. The early buyers like Roger Daniel, Crew Chamberlain, David
>>> Kirshner and others sold the additional cost factor as a savings to the
>>> producer and they were financially rewarded...all paying off their TC
>>> Nagras with a secial extra rate for them, long before most people had
>>> purchased their first IV STC.
>>>
>>> Those same guys bought the early DATs and pulled off higher rates once
>>> again. (I know Jeff Wexler was early too, but I don't re-call if he
>>> charged more then).
>>>
>>> The first Nagra D guys like Lee Orloff and Ed Tice made a killing too
>>> and had a sub-rental business doubling that rate by renting post a 2nd
>>> machine for their shows. The bottom dropped out of the NAgra D business
>>> in a few years time as DAT took over, but those first guys made serious
>>> money. It was like the stock market. The last ones in were left
>>> holding the bag.
>>>
>>> Then the first Deva owners 6 or 7 years ago, like Sean Rush, Jim
>>> Tanenbaum and Glenn Berkowitch re-couped their money quickly and moved
>>> into the profit zone by charging the producer more for Deva's service to
>>> their show. (I seem to re-call that Jeff was an exception, being pure
>>> of heart, might not have been charging more, I'm not sure, but most
>>> did). In fact, most of the early adaptors made a killing on their Devas.
>>> I think Sean Rush was making about an extra $1,000 per week on "JAG",
>>> just for selling them on a Deva workflow that saved them one day a week
>>> in editorial at Echo sound and telecine sessions at Encore Video that
>>> saved 20%+ in time. He did that show for about 8 or 9 years, 10 months
>>> a year, so do the math on that. I think he was not so lucky on his next
>>> show "the Cell" because by now the shine was off and the UPM expected
>>> the Deva as just another part of Sean's normal rental package.
>>>
>>> The point is that in each new generation of recorder, the early birds
>>> got the worm and then, when saturation took place, it was harder to
>>> convince a producer to pay more.
>>>
>>> The best example was to look at what we used to make on Deneke slates.
>>> No one understood it and were grateful the sound mixer would handle
>>> slates was an extra fee. Most of us, at minimum, quadrupled our
>>> investments on those early slates. (The camera assistants blew that
>>> one.) Slates were pure gold, until the producers grew to expect it in
>>> the package. Weather it's because mixers were giving their slates away
>>> through bad negotiating, undercutting or not, it's just the way it is.
>>>
>>> Once the price drops, that's the end of the line. Right or wrong,
>>> anyone getting in the game late missed the big money. The audio
>>> spectulators have already been there and made the big dough...of course
>>> they also carried all the risk too, so I'm happy for them that at least
>>> they were financially rewarded for being the pioneers who paved the way
>>> for the rest of us.
>>>
>>> Doug, doesn't make you feel any better, but dems da facts.
>>>
>>> John Coffey C.A.S.
>>> http://www.coffeysound.com
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


.

Relevant Pages

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