Re: Synching Audio and Video: Newby Music Promo Production

Johnny, Sorry for the 'top post' - but I'm in a hurry and just wanted to
give you an answer.

As I'm not a pro Recordist, take what I tell you from what happens in the
transfer suite. (I do film to tape transfers and we sync in suite.)

I'm not familiar with the gear you're using - but that doesn't really
matter. What *does* matter is using a clapper. Obviously, you won't have the
luxury of smart slates, but as long as the "A" and "B" camera have
photographed the clapper - half your problems are solved. You certainly can
use 'common stix' - both cameras shooting the same clapper - but it might be
better to use the same clapper - but record it from both cameras since
you're usuing different models. (If I understand correctly.) Try to 'hide'
the A camera clapper when clapping the B-Cam and leave a few seconds
inbetween so as not to confuse when syncing the material later. Try to
always call the "A" camera first...it helps.

The next super-important thing is your documentation - make sure you
document any t/c or ABS codes for each take. It might be a pain on set with
a small crew - but you'll be happy you did later in post. Try to get
roomtone or ambiance at each location - a small budget film will need it.

Last, as far as 'drift' is concerned - you should be okay but as nothing is
wired / broadcast to a common source, you're basically relying on the 2
cameras and audio source having a solid x-tal reference or internal sync
generator. Video cameras nowadays are pretty solid and I suspect your
computer aquisition medium would be fairly solid as well. However, long
takes that run over ten minutes might display some drift since everything is
'freewheeling' along. If this is a concern, for long takes you could
'tailslate' them in addition to headslates. That way, you have 2 reference
'claps' should you experience some audio drift. Short of that, it sounds
like you've thought this through.

Syncing in post is easy enough, but might be time consuming is you find
you're needing to use the head and tailslate method. That is, there will
need to be a different 'clip' for shots which work better with the head
clapper and a different clip for the tailslate. It will just mean 2 copies
of each file - but you'd better document each carefully. YMMV.

I'm sure a pro recordist will jump in with more help.
Good luck.
Mike T.









"LoopInfinitum" <johnmarnell@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1122959451.139026.306690@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Hi all,
>
> I'm trying to make a music promo vid (not an artsy music video or
> anything) look as professionally as I can, doing it pretty much by
> myself.
>
> I'm real serious about trying to do it right, and I just spent a good 4
> hours reading over all posts with the word "sync," so I have learned
> some stuff, but I'm still in the dark about a lot.
>
> [b]SHORT VERSION:[/b]
> Using separate digital audio (RME Fireface (firewire) + Sonar4) and 2
> separate videos from different cameras, recording 10 minute
> performances (one take), will I encounter drift? Can I get around it
> and still make a professional looking (at least synched) promo vid?
> What steps should I take in the recording and editing process?
>
> And for those of you kind enough to want to know more, the
> [b]FULL VERSION:[/b]
> My plan is to record myself at various open mics to get the illusion of
> multiple venues. I just invested A LOT (for me, at least) of money
> into a great, brand new firewire sound interface, the RME Fireface 800.
> I have a laptop running SONAR 4 Producer Edition. The rest of
> equipment, I'm desparately borrowing.
>
> I plan to have 2 cameras (I can call this AB, right?) filming me live,
> one doing close-ups, another one filming wider shots. These will not
> be amazing cameras, just mid-range miniDV ones, like a Canon ZR200 --
> additionally, they'll almost definitely be different models... I'm
> worried that will look bad cutting between the 2, and pose synching
> problems? For audio, I'll probably be going out of the PA (a Mackie
> 808s) inserts at line level and into the Fireface and onto SONAR. Or I
> could go into the fireface first, not sure yet (although, since I'll be
> bumming around open mics, I'll need to be as non-intrusive as possible,
> thus probably out of the PA / Mixer). Additionally, I'll have the 2
> scratch tracks from the cameras' mics.
>
> Each shoot will be about 10 minutes long: cameramen, laptop recorder
> all hit record and I do my thing. My big concern is syncing everything
> in post.
>
> [b]Question 1.)[/b] People keep mentioning a clapboard -- I will not
> have this luxury in a public place with limited "crew," I suppose I
> could use a muffled strum before tunes as an aural/visual marker? (heh,
> I usually end up doing that anyway : ).
>
> [b]Question 2.)[/b] I can't afford to buy a real camera that could
> interface with the crazy genclock device I'm also unable to afford, so,
> with these 10 minute takes, will I end up with a lot of "drift" trying
> to match up the fireface recorded tracks with the 2 (count em, 2) video
> tracks (from different cameras, no less)? Is drift reduced if you take
> smaller, individual takes (for instance, in between songs)?
>
> [b]Question 3.)[/b] I hear I should record the audio at 48kHz to match
> the video? -- I don't really understand this btw, shouldn't they
> occupy the same temporal duration, regardless of the sound's bit depth
> / resolution? I shouldn't take advantage of my 192kHz capabilities?
>
> [b]Question 4.)[/b] This one has to do with the overall process;i.e. am
> I going about it right? My plan is to go to these venues, get my audio
> and visual shots. So now I enter post. In looking at the daunting
> task of editing together 2 audio and 2 video tracks (I'm largely a
> newb... I've done some editing with iMovie and even less with Premiere
> for fun, but nothing this sound intensive), my first concern is that,
> for each "shoot," the 2 video tracks and the audio all synch up. So, I
> assume first I should mix my multi track audio to something I'm happy
> with, then export it? Next, I'd move to Premiere 7 with my AB camera
> set up, and do my best to synch the two video tracks (after I capture
> each through firewire), and hope to god the two videos don't drift (if
> they did, I wouldn't even know how to address the problem). Assuming I
> got the 2 video tracks to line up perfectly at the head, now I drop in
> my sound, line that up, and observe the horrible drift I'm
> nightmarishly envisioning running into. To fix that, is my only option
> to try and time stretch my audio to fit the video, or is there a more
> elegant way to try and account for this? Now with everything in line,
> I can make my cuts and hopefully not overdo it with silly wipes and
> Algerian font titles : )
>
> Whew. I realize that was a lot. I'm sorry, I wanted to be as detailed
> as possible so people could give me a good answer. Thank you so much
> in advance for any help!!!!
>
> -johnny
> www.johnnymarnell.com
>


.

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