Re: Pushing off from the heels?

On Jun 26, 5:07 pm, cs_post...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

No, not past the first count, still preceding it. The lowest point
occurs between step 3 and step 1.

Assuming your (both) straight-legged split-legged
position is relatively low, this is a precipitous
drop with way too much horizontal momentum. Since
you claim your standing leg is fully straight by
the end of the first count, your lowering and
rising profiles would have to be "mirrored," and
you have to use brute horizontal momentum to zoom
back up. You wouldn't be able to keep the first
count travel restrained, as every instructor I've
encountered teaches (implicitly or explicitly).
There is no way to alter stride length with natural
motion if the standing leg is always fully extended
by the first count as you describe.

Post a video if you have confidence to back up what
you claim is the superior way.

No, that *is* the controlled and easy way to move. The other
alternative - dropping and then moving - is the artificial and
wasteful one, though it is "safer" for the unskilled, in that there is
less chance of getting it wrong and landing your weight on your
partner. That does not happen in a downswing done right, but it
frequently happens in a downswing done wrong.

What you claim is the (only) alternative way is by
no means the only other way. You seem to be hung
up on the idea that the lowering must be a
"down-swing" or a vertical drop.

You arrogantly believe that the "safer" way equates
to unskilled, when the it is the _skilled_ that
know how to practice the safer ways, able to deal
with all kinds of situations.

This is precisely the evidence that one is *not* balanced at all
times.

Obviously, in the _uncontrolled_ way you move, you
wouldn't be balanced.

You remind me of the dangerous skiers/boarders on
the ski slopes who believe that recklessly behavior
is the superior skill. No wonder ski slopes ban
them, just as some social dance venues ban unsafe
dancers ("competitive" dancing).

as once one is split-legged at the low
point, one has no choice but power out of that position
horizontally, causing the need to rush.

If you are getting stuck down there, you dropped too far in relation
to your horizontal speed - quite likely, you dropped in place before
moving.

Your claim of a straight-legged standing leg precludes
the possibility of a drop in place. Post a video,
if you are confident of "your" way of moving being
in control. In particular, I'd like to see you
showing the ability to execute varied stride lengths
while always straightening out the standing leg by
the end of the first count.

But if you did the downswing right, you will coast through the low
point, onto the arriving foot and part way up the hill in rise. You
will probably also choose to add some additional energy to make up for
the obvious fact that the downswing-upswing cycle is not perfectly
energy conserving.

Sounds like the over-powered way to me. You description
here doesn't sound like there's any way of varying strides
and doing controlled lead/follow. Post a video and show
us you can stay in control.

Only body positions that consist of a displacement against a
conservative force.
Gravity would be one example. If you had a true spring in your body
that could be another, but the problem is that you don't have a real
spring, just some very poor small-scale approximations.

You obviously don't know how to use the "small-scale"
aspects of the body to derive much larger movements.

Proper body compression places the various body parts
in proper leverage against each other, as well as
shortens distances in/between parts so that when the
de-leverage and lengthening occurs, they will have
maximal effect with minimal effort.

Do you really understand how energy storage in a spring works? When
you compress a spring against its spring force, you store energy
equivalent to the square of the displacement times the spring
constant. When you release it - milliseconds or decades later - you
get that same energy back, minus a very tiny amounts of loss. Your
muscles can't do that to a meaningful degree unless you release it
immediately, which you don't in the slower dances.

Read what I wrote. The energy is in the leveraging
of body parts and positioning, not the body parts
themselves. I take it you don't know how to spin
on your skates.

keep baffling us with your BS, hung up on _your_
interpretation of one word. I wonder how effective
you are at teaching dancing, going off on some
pseudo-science rant whenever you fail to grasp
human motion itself. I bet most people can intuitively
understand what being "elastic" and "spring-y" are
in relationship to human motion, even if they are
not adept enough to move thus.

There's energy as a "new age" concept, and then there's energy as a
physics one.

You are welcome to believe whatever you want about new age energy, and
this may indeed help with your dancing. But if you mix that up with
actual, physical energy and try to argue something about the mechanics
of dancing based on that, all you are doing is confusing yourself.

I reiterate my claim that you must dance like a robot.

Without a downswing generating the travel, there is nothing for this
to result from other than muscular action.

How sad that you've danced so long and still think
that brute muscles or outright momentum are the
only ways to derive/handle energy. Ever do Judo?

You are simply proving over and over that you have little idea of
these dances.

Definitely not in the way you know them.

You apparently keep assuming that comp results are how I determine who
is an expert. They aren't.

I couldn't care less what you use to determine who is
an expert. I just point out that _I_ don't care much
about comps, one way or another.

I know some. I would assume there are others. But apparently they
are quite rare, as you don't seem to have experienced any of them.

Most people's notion of "social" involves "common"
rather than "rare." But obviously not for you.

Which is precisely why I've been suggesting seeking out the really
good coaches instead of settling only for the easily available ones.

You are obviously not the master of your own body.

But I suspect you will not be satisfied, because the situations that
make it onto that site are going to be ones where you will not be able
to tell if they are dancing a routine, or simply dancing together as
the mood strikes them. People don't tend to video socials... it's
too dark and a bit borderline inconsiderate of the purpose of a social
dance.

Keep making excuses.
.

Relevant Pages

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  • Re: Pushing off from the heels?
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