Re: Buying A New Tank

"Marco Schwarz" <marco_s@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:dnfg7d$rju$02$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Hi..
>
> [ coldwater, cool water]
>> I'm not sure why it would be limited to tropical fish.
>
> Listen, it's not limited to tropical fish, and I'm not
> trying to postulate it. I'm new to rafm and in discussions
> I generally argue in a practical way.

Welcome to rafm and its merry band of aquanuts, fishaholics, aquariasts,
amateur ichthyologists and hobbyists. We often postulate, debate and
even occasionally agree with each other (close bracket wink -> ;~).
Other than a few trolls whose pop in occasionally, you'll find this group
is generally quite friendly and helpful. We share our observations and
are mostly agreeable to the fact that they will often be different from
the observations of others.

I will apologise for my English, as I tend to exercise it (using new
words) and that's not going to make it easier for someone who doesn't
have a good command of the language. Do not hesitate to ask for
clarification, and if there are two ways to interpret what I say, the
correct way is the one which does not cause you offence.

> Relatively seen you
> can minimize the osccillation by an air stone, by a glas
> panel between water and lamp, by an open tank, or by
> putting the tank in northern or eastern rooms or in celar.

I understand that this is a cooling technique during the daytime hours,
increasing the contact with the atmosphere to track that temperature
closer.

> That's what I do. Outdoors I prefer half dug ponds, sun
> protection, a greenhouse for subtropical fish.

I'm not sure where we are disagreeing anymore.

> And we have
> to decide between eustress (good stress) and distress (bad
> stress), and what is what to fish.

Interesting concept 'eustress'. I don't think that this is an English
word. Can you cite some examples of eustress, or how the word is used?

>> If they can swim through
>> these temperature variances, why can't they tolerate the
>> same range of a temperature swing
>> in an aquarium? I don't know why, but they can't.
>> I've no data on the
>> root cause, only that there is a definite correlation
>> between temperature cycling and disease/ earlier mortality
>> on the fish I have experience with.
>
> They can't. Health is relating to so many other factors and
> science offers a selected view to the things, only.

agreed.

>> I'm envious... any pictures or descriptions which you
>> would like to share with us?
>
> Sorry, no photos, but I am used to help where and whom I
> can.
> North Sea Tank: late 70th,
> Mediterranian Tank: late 80th to early 90th.

You've been playing with aquariums for quite a while. I started in the
late 60s, which were very interesting for the discovery/introduction of
the mbunas. I only became more intersted in biotope tanks in the 90s.
http://fish.mongabay.com/biotope.htm is a site which you might find of
interest.

>> Outdoors, the body of water is usually larger (less
>> temperature
>> variation) and deeper (offering some respite). On a hot
>> day, it's no accident that the Koi go to the bottom, even
>> if there is less O2 there.
>
> Wild carps are resistant fish. Are color and illness
> (genetically) combined?

I'm unsure of your question. I have no experience with wild carp, only
domesticated.

>>>> In any case, unless the
>>>> formula has changed, Cycle is only marginally effective,
>>>> and mostly during the
>>>> ammonia stage.
>
> The effect of bacteria mass of a "normal" dose is
> insignificant. In an "experiment" I took a 10" tank, 2,5
> cm / 1" sand, some life plants and added a full bottle of a
> fluid equivalent to Cycle to that tank. Normally for 400
> liter / 105 gallon. The fed tank became stable in a few
> days.

I'm not 100% certain of your point. You're suggesting that the amount of
bacterial starter is not significant once you have passed a threshold?
This seems reasonable, as there is a limited amount of 'food' for the
bacteria to consume, however an excess of dead bacteria can be
problematic in a new tank. 'Cycling' is balancing a tank to a set of
conditions (balancing waste processing to waste production) and with an
excess of dead bacteria, you are cycling (or balancing) to an incorrect
(skewed) set of conditions, which will need to correct itself later.
Could be insignificant depending on a variety of other conditions, but
generally recommended against taking to an extreme.

>> Yes, and how much of it is alive (some starters are sold
>> refrigerated) and which bacteria are used (while
>> nitrosomonas are not in question, there is a school of
>> though replacing nitrobacter with strains of nitrospira as
>> being the more predominant bacteria at work in an
>> aquarium)
>
> Using filter mud is a good choice.

If freshwater systems, my understanding is that the nitrifying bacteria
will occupy the areas of maximum contact to food and O2, which will be
the filter media, and then to a much smaller extent, the surface areas of
the glass, ornaments and substrate (biofilm). The substrate has a lot of
anaerobic bacteria (breakdown of solid organic matter) but these follow
the more typical 20 minute reproduction cycle, so are not quite as
important to us (from my understanding, but maybe they have been pulling
my leg all these years ;~).

>> No, but the use has been documented by many credible
>> posters in this
>> newsgroup.
>
> Biospira is new to me - let me ask Google.

I think it's a Marineland product. They have had supply problems, and
it's not commonly available (expensive and requires refrigeration).

>> You would not want to neccesarily
>> cross-seed from a pet shop filter
>
> |mostly minus always| offers space for special cases. ;-)
>
>> ;~)
> ^^
> What does it exactly mean? I asked two german and an english
> emoticon data base, but didn't find.

The ;~) - maybe I made it up. I believe the convention would be ;-) or
;o). My emoticon vocabulary is weak.
--
www.NetMax.tk

> --
> cu
> Marco


.

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