Re: (Xnews) Memory Problems reading goups with millions of posts - Thanks ->>> with a P.S. for SCPO (this time no PS but read anyway if you care to)

SINNER <arcade.master@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in
news:Xns97708458B5314louiscypherhellorg@xxxxxxxxxxxxx:

<SNIP>

You didn't say WHICH suggestion helped and there were
some very different ones.

Since mine was NOT one of them, I felt it could be
helpful.

You are commenting on your own statement there. Perhaps to
convice yourself?

WHAT is your problem?

SPCO said:
"Will try the suggestions."

I replied:
"You didn't say WHICH suggestion helped and there were some
very different ones.
Here's another one."

You said:
"Likely, all of them. Used a bunch of suggestions to form his
own opinion. Strictly a guess, but fairly educated I'd bet."

I said:
"Since mine was NOT one of them, I felt it could be helpful."

You said:
"> You are commenting on your own statement there. Perhaps to
convice yourself?"

Now, may I say:
Assuming you meant to type "convince", no, I do not have to
convince myself. I snipped stuff which was necessary only for
someone with a low attention span. I have included it here
twice to help you follow the discussion properly this time.

-- -- --

Not to mention the fact that I clearly stated MY
statement was merely a guess, did you miss that?

You said "educated guess". Look up the meaning of
"educated guess". Yours was merely a guess. I was making
fun of your usage of a common-yet-misunderstood cliché.

No, it was correct usage. It was educated since the OP came
back and said after reading posted sugegstions, he had made
his choce. Nothing Cclice about it, merely a fact.

About as correct as spelling cliché "Cclice" (although you
get points for being rather creative).

Since I can DL well above 250,000 headers in Xnews and
I only have 512 megs of RAM I guess the one lacking
savvy is you.

No, you just have 8 times more RAM. If that makes you
smarter, so be it.

You said _anyone_ trying to get more that 15,000 headers is
not computer savy. In reality what you meant to say was
anyone with an outdated computer trying to read immense
numbers of headers into memory is not computer savy, so
next time SAY that.

1) I said "not very computer-savvy" because I didn't want to
say stupid. (After reading others' comments on our little
discourse, I see I perhaps should not have bothered being so
polite.)

Anyone who wants to DL a million headers no matter what
program or platform or processor or memory they have is
stupid, OK? Just my opinion. (I AM allowed an opinion, I
hope, even though I am writing this on a 166MMX?)

And the reason I believe this is because I know that basic
rules of simple logic and reason apply to everything in the
universe - even if you happen to be running an AlienWare
computer with 2 4GB processors and 12GB of RAM with a
pre-release pirate copy of Vista.

2) If it works and does everything one needs, it is not
outdated. There are people smarter than either one of us who
still use DOS because they feel it is better than anything
else.

-- -- --

If you enjoy scrolling through and analyzing 250,000
headers at a time, then your brain must be very superior
indeed. Try a million for some real fun.

But that wasn't the issue you were addressing was it? Not
to mention that since Xnews makes multipart bins appear
as one file, 250,000 isn't really that much to look
through.

It depends on what group you are in. If you are talking
about a DVD group where 250,000 headers makes for 3 posts,
of course. But you did not specify these details. In some
groups, 250,000 headers is 250,000 articles.

Applying alittle common sence helps. I RARELY see text
groups with millions of posts as the OP pointed out. Since
the majority of newservers that do have such retention are
generally binary related, again I made an _educated_ guess
based on the provided information.

You are backed in a corner and fighting back with a broken
stick. Apparently you must have the last word even if it
makes no sense. As far as your "retention being
binary-related" crap, Giganews has nearly 3 years retention
of text-only groups.

Why do you think XNews has an "incremental retrieval"
box (press Ctl-Enter when entering a group and if it
has a lot of unread articles, you will see it)?

Uhm because Luu thought it was a good feature? Most if
not all newsreaders worth their weight have the same or
similar features.

a) And WHY is it a good feature?

Choice is ALWAY A Good Thing [tm]. You just said you have
a hard time looking through 250,000 headers so what do
you do when you encounter such a group and CANNOT do
that?

Besides its hundreds of great semi-documented features,
Xnews does it and that's why I won't use anything else. As
I said before, I download 10-30K at a time and that works
JUST FINE for me. Xnews' default is 15K, BTW. Not 250K and
not one million. Ponder that one.

Again, you negelect answering the question put forth.

Your original paragraph (from "Choice" to "do that?") is a
little hard to understand. I answered the best I could.

If you read my paragraph again (try to concentrate this time)
you will see that it is an answer - to the extent that I
managed to make sense of the question. To spell it out for
you, I dump the piece of *** that can't do the job and I use
something which can. SPCO's problems ARE OS related and not
Xnews related, I don't care if he started with a self-built
SX-20. If he were so smart, he would have been able to
eliminate the problem himself instead of causing this
discussion which he has now re-joined in a rather regrettable
manner.

-- -- --

(Choice is ALWAY A Good Thing [tm] - Did someone else [tm]
the "ALWAY" version or is that your own creation?)

You seriously lack wit as well as the simple ability to
read and parse a post.

Obviously I can't objectively judge my wit quotient any
better than you can judge yours, but I still think my part of
the above 4 lines is considerably wittier than yours. Whether
it was worth writing is another matter.

-- -- --

b) Not true.

Name one that can't. slrn can, Xnews can, Pan can,
Sylpheed can, I bet OE can too, the list goes on.

I've never used OE but from what I've heard even of it,
even if it does, it probably fucks it up.

Again, not the issue and OE was not the only one addressed.

SO I am not even entitled to say that IMO OE blows? And this
coming from a Linux user. SHAME.

-- -- --

Why do you make claims and then refuse to back them up?

Be more specific. AFAIAC, the next paragraph answers that
question more than adequately.

GrabIt (quite popular
recently) can't, for one. I am not going to try every
stupid newsreader just to come up with exact statistics
for the sake of proving a generalization. And I have no
Mac or Linux experience.

Then why make a sweeping generalization if you cant back it
up?

YOU said "Most if not all newsreaders worth their weight have
the same or similar features." Sounds like a sweeping
generalization to me. The six or so newsreaders I have tried
were SURPRISINGLY different both in philosophy and features.

Most intelligent people realize that, however unfortunate,
generalizations are almost impossible to avoid at some point
or another in any conversation, but they are aware of the
associated problems.

Among other things, conversations consist of facts, opinions,
and generalizations. All those come in form of statements. I
do not "refuse" to back up statements. No one can back up
every single thing they say and demanding that every
statement be "backed up" by facts is immature and
nonsensical. No one has tried every newsreader there is and
no one knows everything and half or more of everything you
hear and read are lies and fabrications. Truth is a rare
commodity, in the computer industry as much as anywhere else.

Although, again, that sentence is probably something I should
not have bothered responding to.

Well, I guess you'd better just come over and kill me
for not allowing the corporations to shove their latest
bloated overpriced crap down my throat when everything I
want, I can do just fine with my machine, and faster
than you.

[above you discuss software]

Nice assumption, but incorrect. I was talking about both. No
normal person "needs" a dual 4GB machine yet people have
them. Just like almost no one REALLY needs M$ Office (let
alone is capable of understanding more than a tiny portion of
its features), but I would guess (please note I said GUESS so
don't challenge me to prove it, if you can restrain yourself)
it's Office that made M$ even more money than Windows.

Did you happen to check my headers to actually SEE what
client I was using before making such a silly accusation?
Corporations and Bloat don't really apply to my OS or
NNTP Client of choice.

Decide whether you are talking about hardware or software.

Why, YOU were discussing software.

As I just said, that was your assumption. Corporations and
bloat are not exclusive to the software part of the computer
world.

-- -- --

Obviously, since you do not use OE, it is not a big
surprise you use Linux,

How the hell do you make that jump?

I worded that sentence clumsily. Maybe I am giving non-OE
users too much credit, but OTOH I think you would agree that
someone dead sold on OE would not be likely to switch to
Linux. If I weren't satisfied (finally) with the way my
systems work and if I weren't too lazy to learn Linux, I
myself would probably be switching to it, since I realized
long ago the most problematic programs around are M$
products.

-- -- --

">> Ahhh, the truth comes out. You are using Hardware that is
outdated by todays standards and because of it, so is your
information.

Quite the reverse. I am using an 8 year old computer EXACTLY
because I know that I don't need anything better for my
internet needs. (If I wanted to play online games at 100fps I
WOULD get a super fast machine and a BB connection. But I
don't so I won't.)

It is people who don't even know the difference between
memory and a hard drive that spend thousands to buy the
"latest and greatest". (I know an M.D. who has a brand new
Dell on his office desk, AFAIK has never turned it on, and
writes all his letters on a fucking IBM Selectric which he
keeps hidden from view! And he uses a LOT of liquid paper,
too!)

Well, I guess you'd better just come over and kill me for
not allowing the corporations to shove their latest bloated
overpriced crap down my throat when everything I want, I
can do just fine with my machine, and faster than you.

Did you happen to check my headers to actually SEE what
client I was using before making such a silly accusation?
Corporations and Bloat don't really apply to my OS or NNTP
Client of choice."

Already addressed above.

-- -- --

and my hat's off to you for that. Linux is too
complicated for me to get into and anyway, after hundreds
of hours of tweaking (admittedly unfortunate yet
necessary),

Not Necessary.

Let's just agree to differ. You really must be every
retailer's dream client.

I get
along with 95B on a 166MMX/64MB/33.6 for the internet and
a 2GB Pentium with 98SE Lite for real work (and no
internet connection) just fine. I bet your processor is
not a Pentium 90, is it?

You are correct. I would also bet MOST people arent, yet
you seem to assume they do based on your past spew of
incorrect information regarding your 15,000 header number.

And you talk about my inability to "parse". Parse that last
sentence, would you? No, most people are NOT Pentium 90's.
And what is they "do" that you are referring to?

And I don't know what part of my "incorrect information
regarding [my] 15,000 header number" is incorrect. I have an
*** AND I have opinions. Just like you.

And since you are SOOOO smart... Tell me, why do
annoying prigs insist on answering posts not directed to
them?

Its the nature of Usenet, if you only expected an answer
from the OP perhaps you should consider email?

Many different people are on the Usenet, and some enjoy
being annoying more than others. I tried to be helpful
while you attacked my viewpoint and advice.

I didnt attack it, I corrected it.

You just confused the issue and reminded everyone of how
funny it is that people insist on installing spell checkers
yet never use them anyway. (Yes, I am assuming you have one
installed. And if you don't, you should get one AND use it.)

-- -- --

I find it unfortunate how much
confrontation enters into almost every group.

And I find it unfortunate how many would like to believe
they are an authority on a topic only to find the
hardware/software they use is so outdated they coul not
possibly speak on the same level as those with more current
OS/Hardware.

Again, this naive attitude (although I bet the retailers in
your area love you) has already been addressed.

-- -- --

P.S. - for SCPO
Since several persons feel Xnews is not very good for
large binary multi-parts, I would just like to say that
while I have never DL'd a DVD, I have downloaded entire CD
images with it and never had a single problem.

Downloading is not the problem, its the number of headers
at issue, that is all.

Enlighten me, Wise One, how you DL anything without getting
the headers first.

If the post is bad, OTOH, you will
of course have problems (and waste time), but with a
little experience bad posts can be spotted fairly easily.
Your problems are likely due to Windows. It took me years
to get it running right.

Any you claim Linux required only hours, I guess you should
consider switching.

Read that sentence carefully and slowly. You really should
take a remedial writing course. Anyway, all I said is that I
have no Mac or Linux (etc.) experience, and since I have my
95B and 98SE Lite systems working just fine, I see no reason
to change anything.

In closing - as much as I enjoy exercising my argumentative
skills, we should probably end this. I guess it's up to you.

peace and love
t.
.

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