Re: Fracking

In article <it8q8602qd2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Ann <afrenchs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On 06/14/2011 03:05 PM, Billy wrote:
In article<it835902drj@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Ann<afrenchs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On 06/14/2011 01:45 AM, Billy wrote:
In article<it68fr0bnb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Ann<afrenchs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On 06/13/2011 05:17 PM, Billy wrote:
Ann<afrenchs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"Lil Abner" wrote.

Since many/most Rural Folks use well water any of you have gas/fire
coming out your faucets or cracking foundations etc from Gas well
drilling"
The just showed on ABC fire coming out of a faucet before the water,
in
an Arkansas home.
------------------

For whatever reason, the op didn't show up on the server, so am
replying
here. I do live where there is Marcellus Shale development.

The gascos probably are technically correct when they claim that
fracking is not the proximate cause of methane in water wells.
So, it must be merely a coincidence that it happens where fracking is
done?

Gas
migration generally occurs at a much shallower depth than the
fracking.
But gas migration can occur from shale wells through natural
fractures
for the same reasons they do from conventional wells and storage
areas;
inadequate casings, intersection with old gas wells, insufficient
buffer
zones, etc.

It's unfortunate so much emphasis has been put on stopping fracking.
There are too many people who will benefit financially for it not to
happen. And, negative impacts which could be mitigated by regulation
and
oversight are being ignored.

That's about as disingenuous a statement as I've seen.

<fracking fluid contents listing snipped>

Saying fracking isn't dangerous, because methane isn't toxic, doesn't
begin to cover the toxic compounds in the fracking fluid itself.

Who said that? I didn't. As indicated, I was replying to the op about
methane migration into water wells.

<info about improper disposal of fracking flow-back fluid snipped>

The proximate cause of that pollution was improper disposal of the
flow-back fluid, not fracking.

Another disingenuous a statement. The pollution is a result of fracking.
That where the pollutants come from. The result is common to wherever
fracking is done.

Look up the definition of "proximate".And surely you are familiar with
"correlation is not proof of causation".

Yeah, that's what the tobacco companies used to say about smoking and
cancer.

Which has what to do with shale gas development?

Empirical results aren't proof, even if more people keep getting lung
cancer after they start smoking. Empirical results aren't proof;
A + B --> C.

What you're saying is that poison and methane coming out of the tap
after fracking is only a coincidence.

Look up disingenuous.

Let's see ... not straightforward or candid, evasive, not taking account
of known information, etc ....

You are making my point for me. You're playing the industry's game when
you insist on a fracking ban rather than legislation/regulations to
protect against the impacts.

There's an easy protection against the impacts, don't frack where there
is drinking water.
Most fracking takes place a mile or so from drinking water sources.

If you see the movie "Gasland", you will see wells virtually in peoples
front yards.

What do you know about fracking?

Incidentally, if you are going to post-edit a discussion, at least
restore your boiler-plate to the correct location(s). And, when you
delete other posters' responses, indicate that you have.

About 70 percent of the globe is blanketed
by water, this life-giving liquid, roughly 331 million
cubic miles of it. But most of that is not available to
us. All but 3 percent of Earth's water is salty; and, of
the remaining dab of fresh water, three-quarters is
locked in ice. About half of what's left, Earth's unfrozen
fresh water, is 2,500 feet or more below ground, embedded
in rock. That's too deep to recover economically. The
accessible fresh water in lakes, rivers, groundwater, and
the atmosphere makes up only half of one-quarter of 3
percentÐfor non-Einsteins, that works out to 0.375
percentÐof Earth's total water. It's precious stuff,
and you sanction its pollution?

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_fracturing#Environmental_and_heal
th_effects>
Chemical Constituents in Additives
The following is a partial list of the chemical constituents in
additives used in the fracking process, as indicated by the New York
State Department of Environmental Conservation.[33]

CAS Number Chemical Constituent
2634-33-5 1,2 Benzisothiazolin-2-one / 1,2-benzisothiazolin-3-one
95-63-6 1,2,4 trimethylbenzene
123-91-1 1,4-Dioxane
3452-07-1 1-eicosene
629-73-2 1-hexadecene
112-88-9 1-octadecene
1120-36-1 1-tetradecene
10222-01-2 2,2 Dibromo-3-nitrilopropionamide, a biocide
27776-21-2 2,2'-azobis-{2-(imidazlin-2-yl)propane}-dihydrochloride
73003-80-2 2,2-Dobromomalonamide
15214-89-8 2-Acrylamido-2-methylpropane sulphonic acid sodium
salt polymer
46830-22-2 2-acryloyloxyethyl(benzyl)dimethylammonium chloride
52-51-7 2-Bromo-2-nitro-1,3-propanediol
111-76-2 2-Butoxy ethanol
1113-55-9 2-Dibromo-3-Nitriloprionamide
(2-Monobromo-3-nitriilopropionamide)
104-76-7 2-Ethyl Hexanol
67-63-0 2-Propanol / Isopropyl Alcohol / Isopropanol /
Propan-2-ol
26062-79-3 2-Propen-1-aminium,N,N-dimethyl-N-2-propenyl-chloride,
homopolymer
9003-03-6 2-propenoic acid, homopolymer, ammonium salt
25987-30-8 2-Propenoic acid, polymer with 2 p-propenamide, sodium
salt / Copolymer of acrylamide and sodium acrylate
71050-62-9 2-Propenoic acid, polymer with sodium phosphinate (1:1)
66019-18-9 2-propenoic acid, telomer with sodium hydrogen sulfite
107-19-7 2-Propyn-1-ol / Propargyl alcohol
51229-78-8 3,5,7-Triaza-1-azoniatricyclo[3.3.1.13,7]decane,
1-(3-chloro-2-propenyl)-chloride,
115-19-5 3-methyl-1-butyn-3-ol
127087-87-0 4-Nonylphenol Polyethylene Glycol Ether Branched /
Nonylphenol ethoxylated / Oxyalkylated Phenol
64-19-7 Acetic acid
68442-62-6 Acetic acid, hydroxy-, reaction products with
triethanolamine
108-24-7 Acetic Anhydride
67-64-1 Acetone
79-06-1 Acrylamide

Saying fracking isn't dangerous, because methane isn't toxic, doesn't
begin to cover the toxic compounds in the fracking fluid itself.

"A 2011 study by Congressional Democrats found that, in the process of
hydraulic fracturing, "oil and gas companies injected hundreds of
millions of gallons of hazardous or carcinogenic chemicals into wells in
more than 13 states from 2005 to 2009," according to the New York
Times.[43] A 2011 investigation by the New York Times based on various
leaked EPA documents found that hydraulic fracturing had resulted in
significant increases of radioactive material including radium and
carcinogens including benzene in major rivers and watersheds.[44] At one
site

the amount of benzene discharged into the Allegheny River
**after treatment** was 28 times accepted levels for drinking water."

It is to be presumed that this was "proper disposal" of the flow-back
fluid, since it was treated.

See:<http://www.gaslandthemovie.com/whats-fracking>
--
- Billy

Mad dog Republicans to the right. Democratic spider webs to the left. True conservatives, and liberals not to be found anywhere in the phantasmagoria
of the American political landscape.

America is not broke. The country is awash in wealth and cash.
It's just that it's not in your hands. It has been transferred, in the
greatest heist in history, from the workers and consumers to the banks
and the portfolios of the uber-rich.
<http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2011/mar/10/michael-moore
/michael-moore-says-400-americans-have-more-wealth-/>
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Fracking
    ... Since many/most Rural Folks use well water any of you have gas/fire ... coming out your faucets or cracking foundations etc from Gas well drilling" ... migration generally occurs at a much shallower depth than the fracking. ... But gas migration can occur from shale wells through natural fractures ...
    (misc.rural)
  • Re: Fracking
    ... fracking is not the proximate cause of methane in water wells. ... migration generally occurs at a much shallower depth than the fracking. ... But gas migration can occur from shale wells through natural ...
    (misc.rural)
  • Re: Fracking
    ... Since many/most Rural Folks use well water any of you have gas/fire ... migration generally occurs at a much shallower depth than the fracking. ... But gas migration can occur from shale wells through natural fractures ... begin to cover the toxic compounds in the fracking fluid itself. ...
    (misc.rural)
  • Re: OT: Shale gas "inherently unprofitable," "Ponzi scheme"
    ... One of the problems with the fracking process is that the industry hasn't ... it's their drinking water). ... Shale natural gas wells operated by Fort Worth-based Range Resources ... were not the source of methane-gas contamination of residential water ...
    (rec.gambling.poker)
  • Re: Fracking
    ... Since many/most Rural Folks use well water any of you have gas/fire ... fracking is not the proximate cause of methane in water wells. ... migration generally occurs at a much shallower depth than the fracking. ... begin to cover the toxic compounds in the fracking fluid itself. ...
    (misc.rural)