Re: FBI Raids Liberty Dollar - Confiscates All Ron Paul Dollar

"Robert Miller" <xyzstargazzr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
news:a001c$476aab6d$97d5954b$26973@xxxxxxxxxx:


"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
news:02laj.32098$JD.14232@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Robert Miller" <xyzstargazzr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
news:d7801$4769d2a1$97d5954b$19770@xxxxxxxxxx:


"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
news:sbiaj.33709$Pv2.15968@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Robert Miller" <xyzstargazzr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
news:5d6b4$476987d9$4b5a1f45$30717@xxxxxxxxxx:


"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
news:vu44j.28953$Pv2.4307@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Robert Miller" <xyzstargazzr@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
news:1a63c$4750c97e$471d0c48$9656@xxxxxxxxxx:

<snip>

ange with which to discharge that debt. Am I missing
something?

A Federal Reserve Note is a promissory note.

A FRN is not a promissory note, since it doesn't say that you can
redeem it for anything. A FRN is legal tender, which means that
creditors must accept it when their debtors discharge their debts.

So what happened the day the Federal Reserve stopped backing their
Promissory Bank Notes with gold. Did they do as many banks before
them and printed more Notes than they had gold to back them?

Of course.

Then did
it again when there was not enough silver in the bank vaults to
cover them again?

Of course.

The value of a dollar (i.e., the goods and services you can exchange
for it) relies on the magical power of the pooled belief in the US
government to maintain a orderly society for commerce. This is not
unlike the magical
property that you've attached to silver and gold. But you can't eat
them either.

Gold and especially Silver have many important uses in manufactureing.
For example the silver in you computer keyboard, or you microwave
touch pad. Silver is one of the most important commodities and used
in nearly every manufacturing process.

And so is titanium, but you're not proposing that as a base for money.
The monetary basis for Au and Ag relies on their magical properties, not
on their industrial usefulness.

A dollar is still defined as:
DOLLAR, money. A silver coin of the United States of the value of
one hundred cents, or tenth part of an eagle.
2. It weighs four hundred and twelve and a half grains. Of one
thousand
parts, nine hundred are of pure silver and one hundred of alloy.
Act of January 18, 1837, ss. 8 & 9, 4 Sharsw. Cont. of Story's L.
U. S. 2523, 4; Wright, R. 162.

Your source is Bouvier's Law Dictionary, the 1856 edition. And it
has no applicability.

Just because you don't appreciate it's application does not mean it is
not applicable. The law is the law untill the law is changed. Right?
So when was the legal definition of a dollar changed? If it has not
been changed, it is still the same.

Law dictionaries are not dispositive. Dig up the "Act" of 1837, check
through the law establishing the Federal Reserve, and get back to me

372.25 grains of pure silver

480 grains = 1 troy oz.

480 / 372.25 = .7755

1 Silver $ .7755 oz pure silver

Sept 20 Monex.com Silver @ $13.36 per ounce Spot.
Dec. 19 Monex.com Silver @ $14.12 per ounce Spot.

.7755 oz. = $10.36 in a real silver dollar Sept. 20 2007
.7755 oz = $10.95 in a real silver dollar. Dec. 19, 2007

Notice a trend?

Not from two data points.

You say below that merchants must accept FRNs in exchange for
their goods. They don't. They're free to set whatever terms they
want. If your corner gas station advertises that they want 10
pounds of potatoes for a gallon of gasoline, then you'd better
have spuds in the trunk when you fill up.

What if they want NORFED's Silver Libertys.

Then you better be lugging around silver if you want to do business
with them.

NOTE OF HAND, contracts. Another name, less technical, for a
promissory note. (q.v.) 2 Bl. Com. 467. Vide Bank note;
Promissory note, Reissuable note.

NORFED's Silver Libertys are money because
they have value even if NORFED is permanately shut down.

I'll repeat here. Money is anything that you can commonly use as a
medium of exchange, i.e., as an intermediary that has no value other
than its exchangeability. Is NORFED's coinage money? I don't know.
I've never tried to use NORFED's coinage in a commercial transaction.
Legal tender, on the other hand, is a special kind of money, the
kind that under the law creditors have to accept as payment from
debtors.

Would you say evidence of debt a promissory note and evidence of
wealth (gold & silver coin) are of equal status whenn they are used as
money?

Tell me what you mean by "equal status," and I'll attempt an answer.

United States Federal Reserve Notes will be worthless the same day
the United States is shut down.

Well, of course. What's your point? You think that the same day the
US is shut down you'll be able to eat Silver Liberties?

I will be able to trade silver coin or bullion for food or energy
unless the government passes a law confiscating all gold and silver.

The hypothetical here is that it's the day after the US is shut down.
The gov won't be passing any laws on that day.

It would be a little
ironic for a government that was formed to protect private property
rights, to
treat the private property of it's citizens as loot.

And your point?

Governments hate competition! Of the 3 most important monopolies,
Money is the first most important monopoly.

And your point?

Robert
.

Relevant Pages