Re: Yep, some more actual Mac advocacy (This is comp.sys.mac.advocacy, after all)

On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 02:15:56 -0700, Hasta La Vista wrote
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"George Graves" <gmgraves2@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 19:24:38 -0700, Hasta La Vista wrote
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"George Graves" <gmgraves2@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 17:52:18 -0700, Hasta La Vista wrote
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"George Graves" <gmgraves2@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 07:49:37 -0700, Hasta La Vista wrote
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"George Graves" <gmgraves2@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 08:04:43 -0700, Hasta La Vista wrote
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"Mayor of R'lyeh" <mayor.of.rlyeh@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 00:42:45 +0200, Sandman <mr@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

In article <5eavv39f8r5ddgk8aq705enoj9oheuur6c@xxxxxxx>,
Mayor of R'lyeh <mayor.of.rlyeh@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Fri, 11 Apr 2008 10:22:15 -0700 (PDT), Dave Fritzinger
<dfritzin@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Interesting article in Business Week.

http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/apr2008/tc20080410
_2
06
88
1.
htm

"The 20-year death grip that Microsoft has held on the core of
computing is finally weakening--pried loose with just two
fingers.
With
one finger you press "Control" and with the other you press
"right
arrow." Instantly you switch from a Macintosh operating system
(OS)
to
a Microsoft Windows OS. Then, with another two-finger press,
you
switch back again. So as you edit family pictures, you might
use
Mac's
iPhoto. And when you want to access your corporate e-mail, you
can
switch back instantly to Microsoft Exchange."

I've been saying for months that Apple is missing a Golden
Opportunity
by not making the fact that any OS can run on Macs the
centerpiece
of
an ad campaign. It might not sit well with the Mac Faithful but
it
would certainly make a lot of other people take a second look at
Mac
HW.

The Get a Mac ads have mentioned this on several occasions.

Its been mentioned in passing but I'm talking about launching a
campaign that has that point as its centerpiece.
Of course it would require Apple ads to actually promote Apple
products instead of taking cheapshots at Microsoft based on
half-truths and outright lies.

If running Windows becomes the center point of Apple's ad campaign,
how
will
they convince people to pay more for hardware to run Windows?


You won't convince them. The fact that a Mac CAN run Windows doesn't
mean
that most do. In fact, most don't.

How do you know how many Macs are running Windows?

I know lots of Mac users. There is a such thing as sampling, you know.
After
all, Nielsen ratings work that way.

So the real answer is you have no idea how many Mac users are running
Windows. You live in a world of your own making and you don't look
past
it.

No that's YOUR answer, the one you want.

I gave no answer about what I want. I only remarked on what the article
said.

Mac users don't want Windows. That's
why They're Mac users and not PC users. Most of us made that decision
ages
ago.

The article quoted in this thread disagrees with you.

You pay a bit more for hardware (in some
cases) from Apple to run OSX.

In my case I found Apple's prices to be double for what I paid for my
PC, for less hardware than I got.

IOW, more of less.

Please explain how 2 GB of RAM instead of 1 GB of RAM is "more of less."
Continue on from there for a faster 500 GB HD instead of Apple's slower 120
GB HD.

Dumbass! Yeah, you got more all right. But its like putting air conditioning,
GPS, an expensive stereo, and leather seats in a Yugo. Sure you got more, and
you got it much cheaper than the same add-ons would cost in a Nissan Altima -
but you still have a Yugo. If that's not enough of an explanation of "more of
less" then it cannot be explained to you.

After you cover those two we can discuss the other computer parts that the
Mac has half of for twice the price.

So you can buy a PC and get MORE of LESS. Big deal. I can buy 50
Double
Cheeseburgers from MacDonalds or one good steak from Ruth's Chris for
$50.
I
don't have to tell you which I consider a better way to spend my $50.
More
of
less is never as appealing as less of more.

I bought a PC and got more of what Apple includes, not less, for half
of Apple's price.

You got a cheap box running Windows. More of less.

No, you got more of less.

No, I got more of the same or better.

That's where you are deluded.

I'm not the deluded one here.

Right! Everyone else in the world is crazy and needs medication, but you are
a paragon of mental and emotional health.

You got a Windows box,

The same kind of box that Apple makes, except that Apple charges you double
for half the hardware.

Same kind of box eh? Try installing OSX on it right out of the box.

running the poorest
designed operating system there is, the lowest common denominator in
computing

It's going to take more than your opinion to make that so.

How about PC Magazine's opinion, or the New York TImes computer guru's or any
of dozens of computer journalists and writers who agree with me?

and you think you got more for less.

I don't just think it, I proved it.

If that isn't a delusion, I'll eat my hat (if I had one).

Just take your meds.

I don't take medications.

I got two good steaks from Ruth's Chris for $25 instead of half a steak
for
$50 from Apple.

Nope Rith's Chris doesn't sell two steaks for $25.

You retreated from your own analogy into literalism.

You've gone from retreating to being completely routed!

You got more of less
because Windows is less, a lot less!

No, I got more of the same or better hardware for half of Apple's price.
Nobody here has given a reason why I should pay so much more to have OSX
instead of Windows.

The hardware doesn't matter any more

Yes it does.

(or so you Winscum keep trying to tell
us

Stop calling me Winscum, unless you'd like me to find some choice names to
call you in return.

It's not personal. It's the group YOU'VE associated yourself with.

- as if you can have it both ways). People have given you reasons why they
are willing to pay a bit more to run OSX,

No they haven't, least of all you.

you've just conveniently ignored
them.

That's just flat out lying on your part.

No one seems to care about your reasons.

That's why so many people buy PCs? Is that why you must pretend that
market share doesn't matter?

Some people are satisfied with
less. it seems, as long as its cheap enough.

Why do you keep repeating your lies as if they were never answered? First
you claim all I care about is market share. When I knock that down you go
back to all I care about is cheap price. How many times am I going to have
to repeat that I got the same damn hardware, except more of it, for half
what Apple charges?

If you want to (or have to) run Windows, buy a
Windows box and skip the Mac.

Most of the world seems to have taken your advice. :-D

And that's just fine. Apple doesn't need for the whole world to buy
Macs.
They do just fine where they are. Apple is a premium brand and I
suspect
that
they'll stay that way. After all, it works for them.

Why is it you don't tell this to all the people who are saying Mac
market
share is going up like a skyrocket?

It is increasing. But it will never be 10% of the world's market and I
sincerely hope that doesn't change.

You want your cult to be limited to only True Believers?

What cult?

The one you lead when you speak for Apple and all of its customers.

I don't want the Mac to become as poor as Windows or as
ubiquitous.

Ubiquitous is the key word here. You wouldn't feel special any more if
everybody had a Mac. Your little cult wouldn't have a reason to exist.


You are brain dead. Look, if the tables were turned and the Mac were the
dominate platform, It wouldn't be as good as it is now. Apple would be making
machines down to a price, just like Winboxes, the OS wouldn't be as elegant
or as much of a pleasure to use. The boxes would be flimsy, made out rough
die-cut steel, you wouldn't be able to swap HDDs or add a new one without
slicing your hand on the sharp steel cabinet at least once. Mac OSX MIGHT be
more susceptible to attack from viruses and would certainly be a target for
other types of malware and adware that we Mac users don't have to deal with
now. Why would I want that to change?
No thanks.


You Winscum

Winscum? You have a name for those damned by your cult?

I have no cult.

Sure you do.

Nope.

But a Winscum is a Windows lover who comes to this NG to
denigrate the Mac.

When have I either professed love of Windows or denigrated the Mac?
Apple
doesn't even make Macs any more.

That's funny. All of my machines say "Mac" or Macintosh on them somewhere.

Again you retreat into literalism.

Because your statement is wrong. Apples computers are Macs because they run
OSX and are made by Apple.

seem to
think only in terms of market share,

In spite of me telling you my choice was guided by how much more I got
for
my money? Little of what you say seems to have any real relation to
actual
people, places or things.

Your overall tenor belies your words.

IOW, you have no real reason for what you say.

I read what you write. It's different from what you write that you write.

IOW, you read whatever you please into what I write, reality be damned.

No. If you wrote what you want me to believe that your wrote, we wouldn't be
arguing now.

a very narrow view of any market, if you
don't mind me saying so. There are lots of companies making premium
products
whose market share is tiny when viewed against the mainstream, but
Bentley,
Rolls Royce, Breitling, Rolex, Vacuum Tube Logic, Martin Logan, MV
Agusta,
Armeria Tucci, E.J. Chutchill, etc., do very well in their respective
niches,
thank you.

What has that got to do with Apple? They only sell PCs like you can
buy
from any other PC maker, except they charge you more for less.

That's why you do not understand the Mac market and you never will.
Calling a
Macintosh "just a PC" is like calling a Brietling "just a watch".

I never called a Macintosh "just a PC."


"They only sell PCs like you can buy from any other PC maker"

Looks like "just a PC" to me.

You interupted the context below.


I called the computers Apple
makes now just another PC, like you can buy from any other PC maker.

Except that they aren't and they won't run OSX without a lot of hacking
and
even then many things don't work.

The hacking is to get around Apple's blocks, or to adapt EFI to BIOS, and
things that don't run are due to lack of drivers, which is a problem even on
Apple's own computers.

That's not all there is to it. Do you know that you have to change the OSX
kernel to get it run on a generic Intel Box? That's more than just hacking to
get around Apple's "blocks" or adapting EFI to run on an old-fashioned
BIOS-based machine (***, one would think that BIOS chips would have gone out
with high-button shoes. How very quaint and IBM XT of the Windows community!

That's what you keep overlooking, and its
what makes a Mac a Mac.

All the hardware in the Mac is the same as in any other PC.

Some of it is, yes.

The fact that one can get MUCH cheaper cars, watches, amplifiers,
speakers, motorcycles, and shotguns, or that some people will say that
one
gets more for their money buying cheaper, more mass produced, similar
items
doesn't lessen the appeal of these premium brands to those who value
them.

More mass produced? Apple PCs are no less mass produced than any
other
PC. It takes more than a premium price to make a premium product.

And apple gives you more.

Why are you shifting the topic from mass production?

Look at Apple notebooks and compare them to Lenvo
or Dell notebooks. The Winbooks are junk in comparison, and if you buy one
that isn't, well guess what? It costs as much or more than the Apple
products.

I don't have to go looking for another comparison to satisfy your rant. I'm
already typing on a computer that cost me half of anything Apple sells, up
to a $1200 iMac. Yet even that $1200 iMac didn't come with as much
hardware as my $400 PC with its $200 monitor.

But you are stuck with Windows. The Mac gives you OSX. And Macs are
generally better made. Even the idiotic Mini is better made than a $400 PC.

As I said, like most of the Winscum who post here, you are incapable of
"getting it". You might as well stop trying.

Take your meds, George.

Again, is that the best you can do? For what its worth, I don't take meds
of
any kind and I don't need them.

Your posts say otherwise.

I also don't pollute Windows newsgroups with anti Microsoft garbage
either.

How nice for you.

So what's your excuse for being here spreading anti-Mac FUD?

What's your excuse for making false accusations?

Seems to me that you're the one who needs to chill and take some meds.

Of course it does. Now take your meds.

This clown sounds like a broken record. According to you, everybody who
disagrees with your FUD needs medications. You sound like Edwin Thorne. Now,
you want to get angry about name calling, here's your chance. To be compared
to Edwin is about as low as it gets here.

.

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