Re: Apple Continues To Condemn The Mac To Niche Machine

In article <44dce435$0$416$88260bb3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
"John Slade" <hitman86@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"ZnU" <znu@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:znu-4616D8.03044211082006@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
In article <44dc0f0d$0$23641$88260bb3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
"John Slade" <hitman86@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"ZnU" <znu@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:znu-802C0A.17453209082006@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
In article <44d9987f$0$13444$88260bb3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
"John Slade" <hitman86@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Yea right. Apple is adding a new feature called Time Machine to
Leopard. It will require an additional HD to function. This
feature is a very good one and will work really well for those
with internal HDs. Those who choose to add external HDs like on
the iMinime and the iMac will have to put them on the outside.
That means USB or Firewire, both are slow compared to EIDE or
SATA. It's a pain using an external HD to run HD intensive
software like games and something like Time Machine.

In the Time Machine scenario, nothing is run directly from the
external HD; data just gets pushed to it in the background as files
are updated on the internal HD. Performance shouldn't be a major
issue.

Oh yes it will when the user wanst to use Time Machine to retrieve
something. It'll be a major issue when you get tired of waiting.

This is a fairly whacky claim. There isn't even going to be a noticeable
difference unless the user is recovering hundreds of megabytes of files,
which is sufficiently rare that using an internal vs. external drive for
Time Machine will probably save, on average, no more than a few minutes
a year for most users.

No it makes a complete backup every single day like it says. For many
it won't take much to do this but for others it will take more time.

What does it matter if an unattended backup takes a couple of minutes
longer? As I said, the only relevant thing is the time it takes to
*restore*.

Either way it's better to have a faster HD. You Apple guys are often
saying how fast Firewire is over USB yet when it comes to this, speed
doesn't matter. How selective you Maccies are.

FireWire vs. USB 2.0 doesn't matter for unattended incremental backups.
Show me an example of anyone claiming otherwise.

Anyway, it's safer to have your backups on an external drive. I mean,
ideally you want real off-site backups, but if you can't have those, at
least having your backups in a device which has a separate power supply
(so it's less likely to get fried if your power supply dies messily) and
is physically a bit separated (in case something, you know, catches
fire) is a good idea. Plus, if your house is burning down, it's much
easier to grab an external drive on your way out the door than an entire
computer.

Oh brother. I know you just didn't make this claim. We're talking about
Time Machine. This program uses a HD connected to the computer. If you have
USB or Firewire and the power supply dies in a way so it burns out the
internal HDs, it will burn out the USB and Firewire stuff as well.

It's possible, but the odds are lower.

So that's a pretty lame argument. An off-site backup is only going to
be used by a select few and not an average user. Time Machine is
about a backup that's right there.

It also supports backup to a server.

As I look on Newegg.com. I see a lot more eSATA devices and adapters for
PCs. There are full fledged adapters and ones that connect to the SATA
connectors on the motheboard and turn them into external ports. They cost
less than $10. Then there are more external drive enclosures that use eSATA.
You can get an enclosure for less than $40.

What's your point?

That is a technology that has been developed and popularized long
before Apple had anything to do with it.

You're having that argument with someone else.

Anyway, laptops are taking over the consumer market more and
more every year, and this distinction isn't relevant there.

Look. People will like laptops until they want something more
powerful and expandable.

Most people use their computers for word processing and web
browsing. And the Core 2 Duo laptops are likely to be faster
than dual-core G5s. IOW, there's not much they won't be powerful
enough to do.

Yea when they want someting for multi-media, they'll want a
desktop. More and more PCs are becoming entertainment centers for
music, games and movies. People will want more graphics power.
With a normal desktop they can go out and choose from a wide
variety of cards. With the laptop, the choices are limited.

Yet, despite this trend toward using computers for media tasks,
notebook sales have grown at 25%/year for the last three years,
desktop sales at only 10%.

That's all well and good but there could be other factors. The fact
that laptop prices have dropped to the prices of desktops these days.
Laptops used to cost twice as much as desktops. Also you don't know
if those laptop users are also desktop users.

Doesn't matter; if they buy Apple laptops, it's still a sale for Apple.

Whatever the trend, people will realize it's better to have a desktop
if they need expansion.

But *most people don't need expansion*. That was the entire point.

When they find how much it costs to get a laptop repaired
when the warranty runs out. Desktops are still outselling laptops by
far. So don't expect most of the market to be laptops any time soon.

IDC says laptops will probably be 50% of the consumer market by 2010.

[snip]

Ask Be about how that works.

Why don't you back up your claims of OS exclusivity.

Go read http://www.birdhouse.org/beos/byte/30-bootloader/

That has to do with tweaking the bootloaders and other sneaky stuff to
prevent users from loading another OS. I'm talking about an agreement in
writing that would not allow the use of a OS on a particular. The BeOS could
be installed legally on those systems. It's not illegal.

From the above:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
So why aren't there any dual-boot computers for sale? The answer lies in
the nature of the relationship Microsoft maintains with hardware
vendors. More specifically, in the "Windows License" agreed to by
hardware vendors who want to include Windows on the computers they sell.
This is not the license you pretend to read and click "I Accept" to when
installing Windows. This license is not available online. This is a
confidential license, seen only by Microsoft and computer vendors. You
and I can't read the license because Microsoft classifies it as a "trade
secret." The license specifies that any machine which includes a
Microsoft operating system must not also offer a non-Microsoft operating
system as a boot option. In other words, a computer that offers to boot
into Windows upon startup cannot also offer to boot into BeOS or Linux.
The hardware vendor does not get to choose which OSes to install on the
machines they sell -- Microsoft does.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

[snip irrelevancies]

As for it being clunky, what the hell does the Mac Pro look
like?

Yes, the Mac Pro also doesn't meet the needs of most regular
consumers.

What? The problem is the Mac Pro exedes the needs of home users by
a lot. It costs too much for average home users.

No, it doesn't. The average price of a consumer notebook is right
around the price of the MacBook.

Are you confused? I'm talking about the Mac Pro desktop being beyong
most consumer's means. I'm sure they could buy one but a lot of money
is wasted on power they don't need. Why are you talking about
Macbooks? Are you losing it?

Sorry, I assumed you were making some kind of actual sense, and arguing
Apple's consumer computers weren't meeting consumers' needs. Because
talking about Apple's quad-core 64-bit workstation not meeting average
consumers' needs doesn't make a lot of sense. I mean, yeah, no kidding.

[snip]

In my experience, ATI and NVida are selling a shitload of chipsets on
video cards. ATI is selling a lot of cards to someone.

Gaming enthusiasts. Who aren't going to buy Macs anyway.

More than that. Many of the cards have video capture and TV capabilites.

If Apple is interested in this, they'll integrate the hardware
themselves. That's the model Apple works on.

[snip]

--
"Those who enter the country illegally violate the law."
-- George W. Bush in Tucson, Ariz., Nov. 28, 2005
.