Re: Price Gouging

Travelinman wrote:
>
> In article <4324D598.6C1D2992@xxxxxxxx>, GreyCloud <cumulus@xxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> > Travelinman wrote:
> > >
> > > In article <4323592E.4E6B9BBC@xxxxxxxx>, GreyCloud <cumulus@xxxxxxxx>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Travelinman wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Guffaw!! You are the one in need of lessons. Your bizarre
> > > > > > view of making a profit has put you in the same league that
> > > > > > crooks are in.
> > > > >
> > > > > Once again, you can't seem to understand the difference between legal,
> > > > > ethical profitable businesses and criminal activity.
> > > >
> > > > Legal, being that you are allowed to. Ethical, they are
> > > > not.
> > >
> > > They're not?
> >
> > Of course not. That's why you are so ethically challenged.
> >
> > >
> > > You said that profits up to 15% were ethical. Exxon makes 9. So by your
> > > own definition, they're ethical.
> > >
> >
> > Sure, uh-huh.
> >
> > Do the math at the pump again and tell me since June of this
> > year that the price only went up just 9%.
>
> First, we were talking about the last quarter. I stated that Exxon's 10Q
> said that they made 9% LAST QUARTER. You responded that that number was
> wrong and they really made 27% LAST QUARTER. What has happened since
> then is irrelevant to the fact that you were wrong.
>
> Furthermore, you seem to be incapable of understanding the difference
> between price and profit. If the price went up 30%, that doesn't mean
> that the profit went up 30%. It could have gone up more or less -
> depending on what happened to the sales volume and also their costs.
>

You are still in denial I see. Do the math at the pump now
as compared to only a month ago.
You'll see that they do indeed make more than you think they
do.

> >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Until you stop your 'oil companies are all evil BECAUSE I SAY SO'
> > > > > ranting, you'll probably never learn anything.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > You will never learn anything till your greed has run its
> > > > course.
> > >
> > > So you got tired of making things up about Exxon, so you switched to
> > > making things up about me. Figures.
> > >
> >
> > Guffaw!! Do you ever give up being an outright liar??
>
> Your lack of an intelligent response is noted.

You are a liar, and it is a noted intelligent response to a
phoney and a coward.

>
> >
> > > >
> > > > > Your loss.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > No, my gain, as I plan on when the oil companies and their
> > > > ilk eventually fall.
> > >
> > > And you STILL won't understand basic economics.
> >
> > As I previously posted:
> >
> > OPEC has jumped up the price of oil by holding back oil
> > shipments.
> > Has nothing to do with your perceived ideas.
>
> Sure it does. As the supply drops, the price goes up. Simple economics.
> WHy is it so hard for you to understand?

No, it is not simple economics in itself... it is those
taking advantage of a very simple model to punish the U.S.
for those that they support and don't support. The picture
is bigger than you think.

>
> > Greed and politics has all to do with it.
>
> Yes, politics is involved in Opec's behavior. That doesn't mean that the
> price didn't go up by supply and demand, though.

Artificial constraints makes it look like it is a supply and
demand model, but you have the tail wagging the dog in this
instance.

>
> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > > > Really?? Does the price of water in Seattle the same as the
> > > > > > price of water in Missoula??
> > > > >
> > > > > The cost of transporting that water is greater, relative to the cost of
> > > > > the water, than it is for oil.
> > > > >
> > > > > City water (which is a commodity) is priced at something like $1.00 per
> > > > > THOUSAND gallons. Gasoline is priced at $2.xx per gallon. Given that it
> > > > > costs about the same amount to transport either of them, can you see
> > > > > why
> > > > > transportation costs could make water costs different in different
> > > > > areas
> > > > > but not have much impact on gasoline prices?
> > > >
> > > > All it has in most areas are the cost of maintaining the
> > > > pumps and supplying electricity to those pumps. The rest is
> > > > all taxes to pay for the personell and government excesses.
> > > > But not all water is a commodity. The reason being is that
> > > > States claim all water rights.
> > >
> > > Frankly, no one believes a word you say about economics, so why do you
> > > even try?
> >
> > And who is believing you??
>
> So far, everyone.
>

Delusional aren't you.
Do you hear these voices on the inside or outside of your
head??

> >
> > Guffaw!
>
> The kind of moronic laughing you keep showing is often a sign of mental
> illness. Seek help.

Guffaw!! That is because I'm laughing at you, numbnuts.


>
> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Now going to Saudi Arabia, water is a precious thing. Hard
> > > > to come by and is more expensive than gas. Yet the price of
> > > > gas there is dirt cheap compared to water. The price of gas
> > > > there is controlled by the family and has nothing to do with
> > > > the oil companies.
> > >
> > > Last time I checked, we don't live in Saudi Arabia. WHy would their
> > > internal politics be relevant to your rants?
> > >
> >
> > Guffaw!! Because they also ship oil, numbnuts. They are
> > part of OPEC and are holding back shipments of oil to drive
> > the price up sky high. If you don't believe it, then get
> > out of your mother's basement and go buy a newspaper.
>
> That's right. WHen supply is constrained, prices go up. Glad to see you
> finally figured that out.
>

And that they are artificially constrained at that. Why
can't you see your own greed??

> Just as when a hurricane wipes out 25% of our refining capacity, prices
> go up.

What for?? I don't get my gas from there, and yet the gas
station has already paid for it a week ago, yet it goes up
anyways. Yeah, it is still greed, but you fail to realize
this.
Regardless of your endless loonie toones view of supply and
demand, you are still a victim of greed.

>
> Why are you incapable of following that?

Why are you just incapable period?

>
> >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Probably not.
> > > > >
> > > > > BTW, that is the case for city water - which is a commodity. Bottled
> > > > > water is not yet a commodity, so there are cases where the prices vary
> > > > > due to supply and demand as well as transportation costs.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Or, I can go to someplaces where the water is free. Free
> > > > for the bottling and taking that is.
> > >
> > > Sure. So?
> >
> > Water isn't a commodity then is it.
>
> Sure it is. Drinking water from the tap (which is what we were
> discussing) is a commodity.

No it isn't. It is a public utility.

>
> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > > > Nope!
> > > > > > Taxes are the only variation to the price of gas. Some
> > > > > > states charge more than others, but when you see only
> > > > > > pennies difference, then some station is not making as much
> > > > > > as another charging the same but paying less taxes is making
> > > > > > more. I see this as price fixing.
> > > > >
> > > > > That's because you refuse to learn the difference between price fixing
> > > > > and market economics.
> > > >
> > > > Market economics don't have anything to do when the big oil
> > > > companies just jack up the price.
> > >
> > > A claim which you STILL haven't supported.
> >
> > Oh, then read the news about OPEC cutting back on oil
> > shipments to cause the price to go up.
> > That's price fixing.
>
> That's not even close to price fixing. You REALLY need to learn
> something about economics.

You need to first go to school.

>
> >
> > >
> > > > They are profiteering on a disaster is all.
> > >
> > > A claim which you STILL haven't supported.
> > >
> > > > Back in the early 70s the investors in oil earned a
> > > > dividend. When we pulled out of VietNam, the oil
> > > > consumption dropped quite a bit. So how do you pay
> > > > dividends to the investors when the consumption is down?
> > > > You can't! So, and many that were around back then can
> > >
> > > ROTFLMAO.
> > >
> >
> > You've got an ass??
> >
> > BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA!!!
> > You seem to have your head stuck up it.
>
> The kind of moronic laughing you keep showing is often a sign of mental
> illness. Seek help.
>

The moron that I'm posting to is nuts.

> >
> > > Before this, I thought that you couldn't pass a third grade economics
> > > test. I overestimated you. You couldn't pass 2nd grade economics.
> >
> > You couldn't pass a urine test numbnuts.
> > And you studied all night for it.
>
> Your inability to come up with an intelligent response is noted.

The lack of any intelligence on your part is noted.

>
> >
> > >
> > > > attest to, the oil companies held back oil production. No
> > > > sense in selling it at a low price when you can wait a bit.
> > > > But worse happened... Nixon put a price cap on oil. So, the
> > > > oil companies just held onto their oil to sell at a later
> > > > time when the price is higher. The evidence was in the back
> > > > log out at sea of all the oil tankers sitting off the coast.
> > > > They weren't allowed to come in until the cap was lifted.
> > > >
> > > > Pure greed and like I've said before... the major
> > > > corporations don't have your welfare at heart, just their
> > > > profits.
> > >
> > > Of course. That's the way our system works. Corporations are SUPPOSED to
> > > maximize their profit.
> >
> > At the expense of people... yeah right, oil company sock
> > puppet.
>
> Yes, that's the way our system works.

yep, just as I thought.
You're nuts!

>
> If you'd rather live in a communist country, there are still a few left.
> However, China won't accept mental cripples, so you'll have to look
> elsewhere.

Gee, a lack of any intelligence on your part makes you look
like the fuckwit that you are.

>
> >
> > >
> > > Are you just now beginning to understand that?
> > >
> >
> > I understand that you are totally clueless.
> > Well, any more fairy tales to tell us shitferbrains??
>
> So in your wierd delusions, 'supply and demand' is a fairy tale?

It is for you.

>
> >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It is basic economics. It is not hard, if you'd try.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > That's why it is called price fixing. Where is the
> > > > > > > > competition??
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The oil companies can sell all they can make. Why should they
> > > > > > > compete on
> > > > > > > price?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The oil companies should be nationalized like some latin
> > > > > > american countries have already done. They recognize the
> > > > > > difference between a commodity and true necessity. When
> > > > > > people can't heat their homes in the winter, then it becomes
> > > > > > a life or death situation that doesn't belong in the hands
> > > > > > of big oil.
> > > > >
> > > > > The funny part is that you're advocating fascism while claiming that
> > > > > Buzz is the fascist.
> > > >
> > > > But the latin american countries involved are not fascist.
> > >
> > > We're talking about the US, not Latin American countries. I guess you
> > > failed 3rd grade geography, too.
> >
> > Guffaw!! Doing the sock puppet shuffle eh, Ragosta the
> > joke??
>
> The kind of moronic laughing you keep showing is often a sign of mental
> illness. Seek help.

You are the one in need of help. You claim that you are a
degreed chemist.
Delusions of grandeur is your problem.

>
> >
> > >
> > > > So your strawmans argument is pretty lame.
> > >
> > > Which strawman argument is that?
> >
> > The one you just fabricated, sock puppet.
>
> Then you should be able to show where.

Your arguments.
All of them.

>
> >
> > >
> > > > The oil that you claim to be a commidity, shouldn't be.
> > >
> > > It shouldn't? Why not?
> >
> > I already explained it to you, pea brain.
>
> No you didn't. YOu ranted your typical 'oil companies- bad.
> Nationalizing oil companies - good' over and over, but failed to provide
> any intelligent response.
>

That's because you are a sock puppet for the oil companies.

> >
> > >
> > > > Unless you have a better way to heat the homes of those that
> > > > can't afford it.
> > > > Are you going to let the poor freeze to death then?
> > >
> > > What does that have to do with oil not being a commodity?
> >
> > It shouldn't be.
>
> Why not?
>
> Do you have any idea what a commodity is? If oil's not a commodity, I
> guess it's a specialty product? Hint: Specialty products are almost
> always more expensive than commodities. Is that what you want?
>

We all know the text book version, joe, now tell me why it
is fixed in price all over the nation.

> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Corporations could care less about people, just thier bottom
> > > > > > line profits.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yet you said that 15% profits are reasonable - and the oil companies
> > > > > are
> > > > > making far less than the amount you consider to be reasonable.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Guffaw!! Keep believing in your fairy tale there. That 9%
> > > > profit they quoted is just pure rubbish.
> > > > It is more like 27% or higher.
> > >
> > > Why should anyone believe you over Exxon's audited 10Q statement?
> > > Especially given that you've proven beyond any doubt that you don't
> > > understand even the simplest economics?
> >
> > How come no one here believes your bull***.
>
> Actually, so far no one has refuted my economic arguments.

Yes they have. It is just that you are denial of your
greed.

>
> >
> > >
> > > > How much did the price of gas go up in the last 6 months
> > > > now??
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It is basic economics. It is not hard, if you'd try.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > There isn't any.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>>>>then you have price fixing.
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>>Not much on logic, are you?
> > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>>Obviously, you have no logic... just a mindset about how
> > > > > > > >>>capitalism works.
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>Unlike you, at least I believe that it does work.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Yep. You believe in screwing the pooch, monopolies and
> > > > > > > > elitism.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > No, I believe in a free-market.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So do I, but with the proper regulations to stifle greed.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you believe in a free market, why are you advocating that oil
> > > > > companies should be nationalized?
> > > >
> > > > Because oil has become a foundation to this paradigm. For
> > > > some it can become a life or death situation.
> > >
> > > You're simply proving that 'free market' is another concept you don't
> > > understand.
> > >
> >
> > Neither do you. You'll screw the pooch for your own ends
> > and means.
> > And that makes you a greedy sob.
>
> IOW, you refuse to admit that I know exactly how a free market works.
>

You don't. You only know it from the narrow viewpoint of
greed.

> >
> > > > For a lot of other businesses it will become a life or death
> > > > business struggle.
> > >
> > > Perhaps. But you haven't supported THAT silly claim, either.
> >
> > I don't see any evidence from you either.
>
> I've supported all my claims. You, OTOH, have supported nothing - except
> the fact that you're a lunatic. THAT has been fully proven.
>

Guffaw!! Keep trolling you phoney chemist.

> >
> > But they do die when they run out of heating oil in the
> > middle of a severe winter.
> > Go google for it smart ass.
>
> People die when they can't afford food or medicine, too. Why aren't you
> arguing for nationalization of THOSE?
>

Because they aren't. Why? Because there is assistance.
Will they get enough assistance this winter??
Nope.
Again, your greed shows.

> >
> > >
> > > > But for the whole nation, it will cause rampant inflation
> > > > and possible economic damage.
> > >
> > > It could. OTOH, nationalizing industries on a whim would cause far worse.
> > >
> >
> > The oil companies need to be under strict control.
>
> Why? Your inane rants aren't justification.

Guffaw!!! And your fuckwitted lame responses.

>
> >
> >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I guess 'free market' is another of those economic terms you will never
> > > > > understand.
> > > >
> > > > Guffaw!! And greed is in your blood, but yet you do not
> > > > recognize the damage it will cause.
> > >
> > > Sorry, but 'greed' (AKA, free enterprise) is what has created the vast
> > > majority of wealth in the world.
> >
> > And greed will be their downfall too. I'm glad that you've
> > understood my point and agree that greed is the driving
> > factor behind all corporations. They don't have one care
> > about you, Joe.
>
> I don't expect a company to care about me. I expect them to produce a
> good product that I'm willing to exchange for my money. THAT is how the
> system works.

And I can see why they wouldn't care for your miserable
***.

>
> It's typically the whiners who can't produce anything of value who
> expect the world to hand them things on a silver platter. That would be
> you.

Only you would lie and steal for it. Typical cowards way
out, eh Joe.

Now tell us for the record, what did you do to serve your
country??
.