Re: OT: 2006 US Elections

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:06:20 GMT, George Graves <gmgraves@xxxxxxxxxxx>
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:

>In article <znu-7BC389.11500626082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
> ZnU <znu@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> In article <kbxPe.4378$Z87.1782@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>> "ed" <news_test@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>> > In news:znu-257C44.00425626082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx,
>> > ZnU <znu@xxxxxxxxxxxx> typed:
>> > > In article
>> > > <gmgraves-78BF19.12354025082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>> > > George Graves <gmgraves@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> In article <430dc2a6$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>> > >> Nicholas Buenk <morn@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >>> Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
>> > >>>> On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:50:15 -0500, Lloyd Parsons
>> > >>>> <lloydparsons@xxxxxxx> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>> In article <7ZaPe.34983$XM3.25389@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>> > >>>>> TheLetterK <theletterk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>> In article <Zm5Pe.2810$db6.1498@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
>> > >>>>>>> TheLetterK <theletterk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Snit wrote:
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> "Lloyd Parsons" <lloydparsons@xxxxxxx> stated in post
>> > >>>>>>>>> lloydparsons-3ACE85.13274024082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx on 8/24/05
>> > >>>>>>>>> 11:27 AM:
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> While we've got a few political postings, I thought I would
>> > >>>>>>>>>> add another.
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Here is where I think the next US elections are headed and
>> > >>>>>>>>>> why.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Here is what the incumbents (regardless of party) have to
>> > >>>>>>>>>> answer for.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Gas: Prices through the roof, with no indication of an end
>> > >>>>>>>>>> in sight. Doesn't matter if they are still cheaper than most
>> > >>>>>>>>>> of the world.
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> This is hurting the US economy ... but, coincidently enough,
>> > >>>>>>>>> helping those
>> > >>>>>>>>> in the US oil industry and those with financial ties to it...
>> > >>>>>>>>> such as both
>> > >>>>>>>>> Bosh and Cheney.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> You should stop paying attention to MoveOn propaganda.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Oil: Ditto
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Natural Gas: projected to be up 58% this next winter after
>> > >>>>>>>>>> the 30+% last
>> > >>>>>>>>>> winter.
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Electricity : up, I don't have figures for that
>> > >>>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Food: By the time of elections, prices will be up, I think
>> > >>>>>>>>>> substantially because of the prices oil is bringing.
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> The cost of Gas / Oil / Petroleum (GOP) is going to hurt the
>> > >>>>>>>>> country in
>> > >>>>>>>>> many
>> > >>>>>>>>> ways.
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>> Actually, most things will be up because of the cost of oil
>> > >>>>>>>>>> to manufacture and transport.
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>>> The price of GOP is not going to do much to help any industry
>> > >>>>>>>>> other than
>> > >>>>>>>>> those directly involved... and they are making record profits
>> > >>>>>>>>> I believe
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>> Because they're selling near capacity, at greatly increased
>> > >>>>>>>> rates. Any situation where you have a limited supply and high
>> > >>>>>>>> demand will result in
>> > >>>>>>>> skyrocketing prices and profits.
>> > >>>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>> They are selling at near capacity in part because they took
>> > >>>>>>> refineries offline and didn't replace them. Thereby creating
>> > >>>>>>> part of the shortage.
>> > >>>>>>>
>> > >>>>>>> In many industries, as volume increases, margins are lowered.
>> > >>>>>>> But in the oil industry they report that they are making the
>> > >>>>>>> same margins. Much of their current fatness in profits is pure
>> > >>>>>>> greed. Greed being fed
>> > >>>>>>> by the big oil incumbents in the white house.
>> > >>>>>>
>> > >>>>>> Well, it is their right to charge whatever the hell they feel
>> > >>>>>> like charging. If someone wants to help out, they can open their
>> > >>>>>> own refineries.
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>> Well, I guess that tells me where you stand as a capitalist, huh?
>> > >>>>>
>> > >>>>> I don't buy that crap at all. When a company is doing damage to
>> > >>>>> the people, then something should be done. And make no mistake,
>> > >>>>> big oil IS damaging our economy.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Maybe we should get the government to quit making it so difficult
>> > >>>> and expensive to build and run a refinery.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Maybe we should get the government to put major resources into
>> > >>> finding alternatives to oil, rather than putting those resources
>> > >>> into securing supply of it.
>> > >>
>> > >> Sorry, that won't happen. NOTHING has as much energy per unit volume
>> > >> as
>> > >> does petroleum-based fuels. Not alcohol, not hydrogen, nothing. These
>> > >> so-called alternative fuels are simply not practical and never will
>> > >> be.
>> > >> At least that's the conclusion of a recent government study on
>> > >> alternative fuels.
>> > >
>> > > I'd be curious to read what that study says about methanol.
>> > >
>> > > Methanol (not to be confused with ethanol, which is pretty much
>> > > useless except as an excuse for the government to give money to
>> > > ADM) has about half the energy density of gasoline (which is more
>> > > than enough), comes in a convenient liquid form, and can be
>> > > consumed directly in fuel cells (with very high efficiency) or used
>> > > in internal combustion engines (much more cleanly than gas).
>> > >
>> > > It's currently selling for about $0.90/gallon. Double that, since
>> > > it has a lower energy density... looks pretty cheap compared with
>> > > today's gas prices.
>> >
>> > isn't methanol mostly produced from natural gas?
>>
>> That's the most common way of producing it today, but you can also
>> produce it from coal (fairly cleanly, as such things go), various sorts
>> of waste biomass, and even directly from water and CO2, if you've got
>> sufficiently large quantities of cheap power (say, from a nuclear plant).
>>
>> This is one of the reasons it's an attractive fuel; we could begin
>> switching over now, with natural gas and coal-based production, and in
>> the future we could switch to cleaner approaches that weren't tied to
>> fossil fuels, without replacing all our infrastructure again.
>
>I thought that most methanol production cam from wood.

It can be produced by heating almost any organic material.




--
"I have had lots of viruses on my Mac..."

Jim Polaski
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... >>> isn't methanol mostly produced from natural gas? ... >> switching over now, with natural gas and coal-based production, and in ... > I thought that most methanol production cam from wood. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... >>> isn't methanol mostly produced from natural gas? ... >> switching over now, with natural gas and coal-based production, and in ... > I thought that most methanol production cam from wood. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... >>> I'd be curious to read what that study says about methanol. ... >> isn't methanol mostly produced from natural gas? ... > switching over now, with natural gas and coal-based production, and in ... I thought that most methanol production cam from wood. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: OT: Mortgage industry bail-out
    ... barrels of oil and natural gas liquids, ... oil are available - 25 times more than the original estimate made in 1995. ... lower 48 natural gas production is not projected to ...
    (rec.arts.dance)
  • Re: An American Source of Clean Natural Gas
    ... U.S. Department of Interior to try to derail the production of clean natural gas in Wyoming. ... The government estimates that the Pinedale Anticline has enough clean-burning natural gas to supply ten million homes annually for more than 30 years. ... America can further develop Wyoming’s energy resources in an environmentally responsible manner. ...
    (soc.retirement)