Re: OT: 2006 US Elections

In article <znu-257C44.00425626082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
ZnU <znu@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> In article
> <gmgraves-78BF19.12354025082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
> George Graves <gmgraves@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > In article <430dc2a6$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
> > Nicholas Buenk <morn@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >
> > > Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
> > > > On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:50:15 -0500, Lloyd Parsons
> > > > <lloydparsons@xxxxxxx> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>In article <7ZaPe.34983$XM3.25389@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
> > > >>TheLetterK <theletterk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>In article <Zm5Pe.2810$db6.1498@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
> > > >>>> TheLetterK <theletterk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>>Snit wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>>"Lloyd Parsons" <lloydparsons@xxxxxxx> stated in post
> > > >>>>>>lloydparsons-3ACE85.13274024082005@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx on 8/24/05 11:27
> > > >>>>>>AM:
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>While we've got a few political postings, I thought I would add
> > > >>>>>>>another.
> > > >>>>>>>Here is where I think the next US elections are headed and why.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Here is what the incumbents (regardless of party) have to answer
> > > >>>>>>>for.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Gas: Prices through the roof, with no indication of an end in
> > > >>>>>>>sight.
> > > >>>>>>>Doesn't matter if they are still cheaper than most of the world.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>This is hurting the US economy ... but, coincidently enough,
> > > >>>>>>helping
> > > >>>>>>those
> > > >>>>>>in the US oil industry and those with financial ties to it... such
> > > >>>>>>as
> > > >>>>>>both
> > > >>>>>>Bosh and Cheney.
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>You should stop paying attention to MoveOn propaganda.
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Oil: Ditto
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Natural Gas: projected to be up 58% this next winter after the
> > > >>>>>>>30+%
> > > >>>>>>>last
> > > >>>>>>>winter.
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Electricity : up, I don't have figures for that
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Food: By the time of elections, prices will be up, I think
> > > >>>>>>>substantially because of the prices oil is bringing.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>The cost of Gas / Oil / Petroleum (GOP) is going to hurt the
> > > >>>>>>country
> > > >>>>>>in
> > > >>>>>>many
> > > >>>>>>ways.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>Actually, most things will be up because of the cost of oil to
> > > >>>>>>>manufacture and transport.
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>The price of GOP is not going to do much to help any industry other
> > > >>>>>>than
> > > >>>>>>those directly involved... and they are making record profits I
> > > >>>>>>believe
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>Because they're selling near capacity, at greatly increased rates.
> > > >>>>>Any
> > > >>>>>situation where you have a limited supply and high demand will
> > > >>>>>result
> > > >>>>>in
> > > >>>>>skyrocketing prices and profits.
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>They are selling at near capacity in part because they took
> > > >>>>refineries
> > > >>>>offline and didn't replace them. Thereby creating part of the
> > > >>>>shortage.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>In many industries, as volume increases, margins are lowered. But in
> > > >>>>the oil industry they report that they are making the same margins.
> > > >>>>Much of their current fatness in profits is pure greed. Greed being
> > > >>>>fed
> > > >>>>by the big oil incumbents in the white house.
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Well, it is their right to charge whatever the hell they feel like
> > > >>>charging. If someone wants to help out, they can open their own
> > > >>>refineries.
> > > >>
> > > >>Well, I guess that tells me where you stand as a capitalist, huh?
> > > >>
> > > >>I don't buy that crap at all. When a company is doing damage to the
> > > >>people, then something should be done. And make no mistake, big oil IS
> > > >>damaging our economy.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Maybe we should get the government to quit making it so difficult and
> > > > expensive to build and run a refinery.
> > >
> > > Maybe we should get the government to put major resources into finding
> > > alternatives to oil, rather than putting those resources into securing
> > > supply of it.
> >
> > Sorry, that won't happen. NOTHING has as much energy per unit volume as
> > does petroleum-based fuels. Not alcohol, not hydrogen, nothing. These
> > so-called alternative fuels are simply not practical and never will be.
> > At least that's the conclusion of a recent government study on
> > alternative fuels.
>
> I'd be curious to read what that study says about methanol.
>
> Methanol (not to be confused with ethanol, which is pretty much useless
> except as an excuse for the government to give money to ADM) has about
> half the energy density of gasoline (which is more than enough), comes
> in a convenient liquid form, and can be consumed directly in fuel cells
> (with very high efficiency) or used in internal combustion engines (much
> more cleanly than gas).
>
> It's currently selling for about $0.90/gallon. Double that, since it has
> a lower energy density... looks pretty cheap compared with today's gas
> prices.

As a fuel additive or as one of a myriad of alternative fuel strategies,
methanol might be a player, but as a gasoline replacement its a
non-starter. To begin with, do you know how much arable land it would
take to grow enough trees to make the quantity of methanol required to
replace gasoline? How about all there is and then some? The problem with
partial solutions is that they tend to be impractical. Today, you stop
at a service station and you buy gasoline or Diesel oil. That's it.
Imagine the complexity of the distribution system if we had to dispense
gasoline, gasohol, petroleum Diesel, Bio-Diesel, methanol, hydrogen,
methane, and lord only knows what-all? Sounds impractical to me. I might
be wrong, but I don't see it working.
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... NOTHING has as much energy per unit volume as ... >>> alternative fuels. ... >> I'd be curious to read what that study says about methanol. ... >> half the energy density of gasoline, ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... NOTHING has as much energy per unit volume as ... >>> alternative fuels. ... >> I'd be curious to read what that study says about methanol. ... >> half the energy density of gasoline, ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: OT: 2006 US Elections
    ... > As a fuel additive or as one of a myriad of alternative fuel ... > strategies, methanol might be a player, but as a gasoline replacement ... > take to grow enough trees to make the quantity of methanol required to ... 89, and 91 octane gas, diesel, and sometimes kerosene. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Methanol -- back to the future
    ... of gasoline at that time. ... In California there were some 60 gas stations that installed methanol ... Detroit introduced at least four lines of these flex-fueled ...
    (sci.energy)
  • Re: Methyl Hydrate
    ... Alcohols like methanol and ethanol do not even mix with gasoline. ... You don't just dump some alcohol into a vat of gasoline and stir it ... Maybe the car is burning too much oil that is getting past worn valve ...
    (rec.autos.tech)