Re: How to unformat CD-RW to blank state?

Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>>>>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>>>>>> Rod Speed <rod_speed@xxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>>>>>>>>>>> Russell May <russmay@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> How can I unformat a 3-inch CD-RW disk to a blank
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (virgin) state?
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> You cant.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hope to unformat some disks so I can run diagnostic
>>>>>>>>>>>>> tests.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do not want to recover data, file structure, or anything
>>>>>>>>>>>>> else. I hope to make the disks appear never to have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>> formatted. I do not want to buy new disks.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> There is no alternative.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I have only a couple of unformatted 3-inch CD-RW disks,
>>>>>>>>>>> so I don't want to let the CRW-F1E touch them until I
>>>>>>>>>>> determine what is causing the problem. The minimum
>>>>>>>>>>> purchase for Plextor-recommended 3-inch CD-RW disks
>>>>>>>>>>> is of 50 disks, which would be a lifetime supply for me.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, there have always been real downsides with testing CD
>>>>>>>>>> burners when the problem isnt completely black and white.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I can buy a pack of five 3-inch CD-RW disks locally
>>>>>>>>>>> and inexpensively, but they are Memorex brand
>>>>>>>>>>> which is not> recommended by Plextor.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> That is the type of 3-inch CD-RW disks which I have.
>>>>>>>>>>> The PX-716A could be slightly incompatible with them
>>>>>>>>>>> despite being able to format, write, and read them if
>>>>>>>>>>> they have not been touched by the CRW-F1E.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Several brands of 21-minute CD-RW disks are recommended
>>>>>>>>>>> by Plextor. Only Ritek brand of 24-minute CD-RW disks is
>>>>>>>>>>> recommended by Plextor. I have not found any vendor
>>>>>>>>>>> anywhere which sells them.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> That doesnt alter the fact that there is no
>>>>>>>>>> way to get a CDRW back to the virgin state.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Problem symptoms:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have a new Plextor PX-716A drive which will format,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> read,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> and write to a 3-inch 24-minute CD-RW disk IF the disk has
>>>>>>>>>>>>> never been touched by my Yamaha CRW-F1E drive. If the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> CRW-F1E has formatted, erased, or written to the CD-RW
>>>>>>>>>>>>> disk, then the disk is completely unusable in the PX-716A:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "My Computer" is unresponsive and its drive/file view is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> blank, until I manually eject the disk. No disk drives or
>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything else appears in that part of the window.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> This happens only for 3-inch CD-RW disks.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I use Windows XP Home SP2 and Nero InCD 4
>>>>>>>>>>>>> version 4.3.20.1 software. I do not use Mt Ranier
>>>>>>>>>>>>> format: Its InCD 4 Options checkbox is blank.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> See what happens if you dont use InCD.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Which of these are you recommending?
>>>>>>>>>>> 1. Burn a formatted 3-inch CD-RW disk in the CRW-F1E
>>>>>>>>>>> as if the disk were a CD-R, for example via Nero Burning
>>>>>>>>>>> ROM. See whether the disk is usable by the PX-716A.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> That will do fine.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 2. Uninstall InCD 4 and install the Roxio Drag-to-Disc
>>>>>>>>>>> packet writing software. Format a 3-inch CD-RW disk
>>>>>>>>>>> with the CRW-F1E via the Roxio Drag-to-Disc software.
>>>>>>>>>>> See whether the disk is usable by the PX-716A.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> I wouldnt go that route until 1 works fine.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 3. Something else. If so, what?
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Today I will reformat and write a couple of 3-inch CD-RW
>>>>>>>>>>> disks on the two CD drives on my computer at work using
>>>>>>>>>>> InCD 4, and see whether they are usable by the PX-716A.
>>>>>>>>>>> That might help to determine whether the problem is mainly
>>>>>>>>>>> from the PX-716A or the CRW-F1E.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, thats certainly worth trying if you still see the
>>>>>>>>>> problem with Nero itself. There are certainly some faults in
>>>>>>>>>> a cd burner which only affect the initial formatting of the
>>>>>>>>>> virgin blank, tho they usually produce a different symptom,
>>>>>>>>>> failure to complete the initial format.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> The main reason for seeing what happens without InCD
>>>>>>>>>> is that those packet writing systems are notorious for
>>>>>>>>>> having more problems than the other way of writing CDs.
>>
>>>>>>>>> I tried your first suggestion. No go. Then I erased a disk
>>>>>>>>> with the CRW-F1E and tried to write to it with Nero Burning
>>>>>>>>> ROM. No go. I uninstalled InCD and tried that again. No go.
>>>>>>>>> The 3-inch CD-RW disks formatted and written at work can be
>>>>>>>>> read by the PX-716A and sometimes written by it, but
>>>>>>>>> unreliably. Nothing works. Everything eventually results in
>>>>>>>>> the disk being marked
>>>>>>>>> as read-only, or a data I/O error; usually followed by the
>>>>>>>>> disk not being recognizable, sometimes by either drive.
>>>>>>>>> Nothing works.
>>
>>>>>>>>> I am now pretty much convinced the Memorex 3-inch CD-RW
>>>>>>>>> disks are simply incompatible with my Plextor PX-716A.
>>
>>>>>>>> It cant be that.
>>
>>>>>>>>> That's disappointing but it is not a big problem because
>>>>>>>>> I can use them in the Yamaha CRW-F1E, as I have done
>>>>>>>>> for 2-3 years. I discovered the problem when I tried to
>>>>>>>>> use a 3-inch CD-RW in both drives. I just can't do that.
>>
>>>>>>> When the 3-inch CD-RW disk is inserted, the drive pauses for
>>>>>>> several seconds, then blinks amber twice -- pauses -- blinks
>>>>>>> twice -- etc. That Plextor blink code is for "Auto adjustment
>>>>>>> failed" -- "Cannot read a stamped disc or initialize a CD-R/RW
>>>>>>> disc because the drive cannot properly configure the focus and
>>>>>>> track adjustment settings". Plextor solutions include "If this
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>> a recordable or rewritable disc, try another one from a
>>>>>>> different manufacturer".
>>
>>>>>> Its more complicated than that because you have said
>>>>>> that they are fine if they havent been in the Yamaha.
>>
>>>>>>> An obvious next step would be to try some Plextor-recommended
>>>>>>> 3-inch CD-RW disks. I unwilling to buy them now. The PX-716A
>>>>>>> drive seems to work okay for my other media, and my other drive
>>>>>>> works okay for the Memorex 3-inch CD-RW disks, so it's not
>>>>>>> extremely important for me to troubleshoot much more.
>>
>>>>>> Sure, but thats a separate matter to what the problem is.
>>
>>>>>>> If you have any other suggestions, I would certainly appreciate
>>>>>>> them.
>>
>>>>> From above: "The 3-inch CD-RW disks formatted and written at
>>>>> work can be read by the PX-716A and sometimes written by it, but
>>>>> unreliably. Nothing works. Everything eventually results in the
>>>>> disk being marked as read-only, or a data I/O error; usually
>>>>> followed
>>>>> by the disk not being recognizable, sometimes by either drive."
>>
>>>> Irrelevant to your claim that 'Memorex 3-inch CD-RW disks
>>>> are simply incompatible with my Plextor PX-716A' when you
>>>> dont have a problem when they are only used in the Plextor.
>>
>>>>> I forgot to mention that once the failure caused the computer
>>>>> to become unresponsive. I had to reset the computer.
>>
>>>> Thats not that unusual when the drive has a problem with the media.
>>
>>>>> The Plextor drive did format and write nearly all of the virgin
>>>>> disk, but maybe I did not try enough operations with it to
>>>>> cause a failure. I observed this on Friday and verified it on
>>>>> Monday: On two disks that I formatted and wrote at work,
>>>>> I got one to three operations each (where I wrote a file
>>>>> and then tried to read it) on the PX-716A before failure.
>>>>> The Yamaha drive was not involved until after the failure,
>>>>> when I tried to read the disk with it.
>>
>>>> Then you havent done enough testing to say anything useful.
>>
>>> I tried this, entirely with the Plextor PX-716A.
>>
>>> Format a virgin Memorex 3-inch CD-RW disk with InCD, open
>>> "My Computer", write about 65MB of text and PDF files to the
>>> disk, open and read many of those files: No problem.
>>
>>> Close "My Computer", manually eject the disk, reload the disk
>>> without removing it from the drive tray, open "My Computer": "My
>>> Computer" is unresponsive and its drive view is blank. After a
>>> while, the drive blinks amber twice periodically. (The drive does
>>> not recognize the disk.)
>>
>>> Manually eject the disk. "My Computer"
>>> starts working again. The drive stops blinking.
>>
>> Still not enough testing to say anything useful, most
>> obviously with not using packet writing software.
>>
>> Until you try it without using packet writing software, you
>> cant say if those blanks are imcompatible with that burner.

> I tried this, entirely with the Plextor PX-716A.

> Write the same 65MB of text and PDF files to a virgin Memorex 3-inch
> CD-RW disk with Nero Burning ROM (at 4X, with verification on and
> Power Rec off, close the disk at completion), open "My Computer"
> without ejecting the disk, open and read many files: No problem.

> Close "My Computer", manually eject the disk, reload
> the disk without removing it from the drive tray, open
> "My Computer", open and read more files: No problem.

So the problem is clearly with packet writing, not with that media in that
drive.

> So that worked. But I want to use the disks as CD-RW disks.
> I don't want always to erase a disk before writing something
> to it. I use them for carrying data between home, work, etc;
> much like many people now use USB flash drives.

Why not use a USB flash drive instead ?

> I have not yet tried reading the disk with any other drive.

> I have not tried any of the Plextor or Roxio software.

> I have not run the Plextor disk diagnostic routine. (Disconnect the
> IDE cable, jumper the drive as Slave and Cable Select, turn on power
> with the Eject button pressed, wait about nine minutes for the test to
> complete and give a Go or No-Go indication.) Plextor will not tell me
> whether the routine will work for 3-inch disks. I don't want a 3-inch
> disk to damage the drive. I doubt whether running the diagnostic
> routine with a 5.25-inch disk from a different manufacturer would
> be relevant to this problem.

> I have only one virgin 3-inch CD-RW disk left. I don't mind buying
> five more disks but I don't want to buy a lifetime supply of fifty.
> Six disks have served me well for 2-3 years. One of them wore out.

> What next?

Consider whether a USB flash drive is a lot less hassle.


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