Re: P112 Support Group Established

On 2005-10-26, Guy Macon <> wrote:
>>especially since the only other approach is to stop rejecting
>>spam entirely.
> Straw Man. You have been told of another approach several times.
> Stop rejecting messages that claim to be from Yahoo groups and
> instead silently discard them.

This is a Bad Idea, according to the folks who write MTAs. I'll take their
word about how things should be done over yours.

>>>>This is part of what makes it such a pain to deal with: I then
>>>>have to go back over all of the groups I'm subscribed to and
>>>>see what messages I haven't received.
>>> You don't *have* to do that. You *choose* to do that.
>>Yeah, I suppose I could simply accept that I'm gonna lose
>>messages from Y!G instead...
> How so? Tell me in detail how a message will get to you if you
> reject messages from Yahoo groups but will not gey to you if you
> silently drop the exact same messages. What's the mechanism?

That's not what I said. What I said was that I can either go back over Y!G's
archives of the groups I'm subscribed to, or else lose messages.

> That author is unwilling to change and that behavior is broken.

You're free to ask Dr. Venema himself. He'll be happy to explain in detail
why Postfix will not be changed to allow what you claim is the right answer.
You can find him through the Postfix home page, at http://www.postfix.org .

> Yahoo is unwilling to change and has broken behavior. So why
> are you blaming Yahoo instead of the MTA author?

Because Yahoo! is broken, and Postfix is not, and because:

>>In any event, it's only Y!G that behaves in that broken manner.

No other mailing list software acts as Y!G does.

> Most spam filtering systems don't behave in such a way as to
> trigger Yahoo's blocking...

Most spam filtering mechanisms either accept and bounce, accept and discard
silently, or accept and file in a junk folder. None of these are acceptable
to me. The right way to deal with spam is to never accept it in the first
place.

>>No other mailing list manager responds to rejections the way Y!G
>>does. In particular, mailman, the mailing list manager used at
>>Feedle, does not. If Y!G is broken, why is everyone defending it?
> If someone told you "I refuse to use spam filters or firewalls
> aaand I demand that all spammers and virus authors stop it!"
> and you gave the obvious advice, would you then be defending
> spammers and virus authors?

Non sequitur.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC
http://www.conmicro.cx
http://www.tronguy.net (Yes, that's me!)
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com
.

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