Re: Crockford's JavaScript, The Good Parts (a book review).

On Aug 19, 6:30 am, lorlarz <lorl...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Aug 18, 8:21 pm, Peter Michaux <petermich...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Aug 18, 5:19 pm, lorlarz <lorl...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

[snip]

There is no "complete" book available to learn browser scripting.

I agree. You must read several books, preferable loaded with working
examples. Nothing like that in Crockford, so what he offers is
something
else. Style advice and principles of good coding, and that is all.
Very little,
esp. since dealing with things that AFFECT the UI is a huge topic area
not
dealt with at all by him.

He is not writing about UI *on* *purpose*!


[snip]

For any purpose for which
ECMAScript aka
JavaScript is used. Fact. *There is no UI*.

JavaScript doesn't have any UI so it is a good thing he didn't cover
it then.

Indeed JS has no UI of its own. What I meant of course is that
Crockford
covers NONE of the functions that interact with and change the visible
components
of the DOM (that which changes the UI for the user in response to
interaction, or
as time passes)

He doesn't discuss those things because they are *out* *of* *scope*
for his book.


Of course, those ignorant of
JavaScript can get some predone and prepackaged stuff from Yahoo's
(and Crockford's) YUI,

There is an assumption here that Crockford influences YUI but I don't
see a great deal of influence when I look in the YUI code.

but
you will remain ignorant of some of the elementals -- the real
specifics of the
language and it will be a crutch.

Leaving out coverage of good uses of functions that manipulate CSS and
DOM
is a huge incompleteness to any presentation of JavaScript.

No it isn't. If a book is to discuss JavaScript in specific it should
*not* discuss CSS and/or the DOM.


It is not
like
there are not better and worse ways to do things here. For example,
one
big issue is CSS vs DOM manipulation, which both can accomplish the
same thing.
How to do thing correctly with good combinations of DOM features and
CSS and
then using the related functions is a HUGE area where we need to
develop good
practice.

Sounds like you should be writing "Browser Scripting: The Good Parts"
because no one has set out to do that yet.


I am being to doubt tha Crockford ever deals with anything people see
in a
browser, this extreme larger oversight is so tremedous.

It was not an oversight.


The book was not meant to be a programmers only source of information
about JavaScript.

I don't think Crockford's book is perfect but it is a worthwhile read
even if it just causes the reader to reconsider some of his own
practices.

What is your point anyway?

My point is: Even as a book that is trying to present just some best
practices
and principles for doing things, this book does less than half a job.

The book sets out to discuss the parts of the JavaScript language
which Crockford thinks are the good parts. That is a good idea for a
book.


The book, claiming to cover the 'good parts' of JavaScript is really
so misleading

I don't think so.

in making that claim as to be fraudulent.

I don't think so.

You seem to either desperately want the book to be something it wasn't
intended to be or your money back. I don't understand your motivation.


Crockford claims he does
twice a job
than what he actually does (and probably much less). The DOM
manipulation vs
CSS issue and best practices and principles to use here would fill 300
pages
(being just the same sort of practices and principles subset book that
Crockford's
is).

Crockford's description of what he is offering is so inaccurate as to
be delusional.

I didn't find it to be inaccurate. I'm somewhat dumbfounded that you
do find it inaccurate and are so angry and disappointed about that
misunderstanding.


By the way, I am no JS library lover. I do all raw and from scratch
in most of
my programs. SO I DO KNOW OF WHAT I SPEAK.

Good for you.

Peter
.

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