Re: Data source options
- From: "dawn" <dawnwolthuis@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: 25 Oct 2005 19:07:42 -0700
Ross Ferris wrote:
> Dawn,
>
> We have a couple of examples of this with people using Visage. Indeed,
> the very FIRST Visage deployment we did was for a Hong Kong based
> company that sold hotel memberships - Database was in Australia, with
> web server & users in HK.
>
> Likewise we have people where website is housed @ ISP, but database is
> at their office.
>
> If I'm reading the requirement correctly, this is more along the lines
> of what you are seeking?
Yes, sounds like it. I'm looking to see if there is any site similar
to gmail.com that I could navigate to on the internet where the
application was running and requested a data source so that the data
was not hosted. In the access vs. ownership mix, I'm looking for a
customer to access the app and own the data.
It sounds like you have the technology, although not in an open source
hosted "free for all to use" way. I was googling for a free-to-use app
on the web that used this approach. I think that saleforce.com and
other asp apps provided hosted data with download features, and they
are also for-pay services.
> When your "client" houses their own database
> (or may be provided by a provider like EasyCo, Midwest etc, and YOU (or
> YOUR ISP) house the actual web server.
>
> One of our VARS already has a service along the lines you are talking
> (I think) is running an ASP style model for an application - people
> sign up, and everyone uses the SAME application, BUT they are hooked
> into difference databases (which are just seperate accounts)
Yes, that is what I'm looking for. I couldn't think of why it wouldn't
be a reasonable approach but I could find no open source applications
handled as database-only installations.
It seems like it could be a way to promote a database environment. If
you have a hosted app that is free for use if you use one of these
database products ...,
> The only "catch" to this scenario, at least with Visage, but imagine
> anything else as well, is that there are times when you want/need to
> run code on the database server there does have to be "stuff" loaded
> onto the server (triggers, procedures etc)
If the database has an api for required actions that cannot be done
through a web-based interface, that would be a problem with this
scenario.
> The architecture we have employed with Vsiage allows us t do this
> 'easily' (part of our basic design) because there is no "hard coded"
> notion of a data source for a page. Instead the pages deal with an
> abstraction layer, and the middleware takes care of connections to the
> actual data sources.
good design
> So, a single Visage middleware/web sever can be hooked into multiple
> database servers (and each database server can have multiple active
> accounts), yet the clients operate from a single copy of the
> "application" (static web pages with dynamic data content)
>
> Can ghet a little more "interesting", because we can actually have
> different things happenning for different database accounts, but that
> is a whole other story.
>
> FWIW, we are also playing with letting the middleware talk to non-MV
> databases at the moment
If you say "SQL" in a few words and are not planning to use something
already written and debugged over many years (I don't know which work
well - IBM? OnGroup? jBASE?), I might try to dissuade you. The devil
is in the details: mapping between 2-valued and 3-valued logic, mapping
ordered nested lists, loose compared to strong typing issues, derived
data (aka virtual fields), database triggers & constraints, metadata,
dates, etc.
> ....we sort of do that now with a few XML data
> sources,
Really? OK, you've got my attention. What XML data sources are you
using for data persistence? XML documents in the file system? Any
"XML databases"? I'm all ears.
> but are looking at providing an abstraction layer that for ANY
> supported database (Oracle, SQL Server, DB2 etc)
I understand there might be good rationale, but I can hear the dollars
getting sucked into that project. Look how many folks out there are
working on O-R mapping in light of XML. As soon as the access language
after SQL, to be used for XML persistence, starts making a dent (XQuery
and/or maybe something that comes from the RSS 2.0+ folks) then the
companies that focus on data source connectivity will be there.
Instead of pouring the dollars into your own proprietary approach, you
might be able to plug in something more standard, more quickly if you
wait a bit. Not that I have an opinion on this topic ;-) but feel free
to chat offline.
> ... this is a longer
> term project, but the results will be "interesting"
I've lived it. It is interesting, and I'm absolutely certain it is
more fun for he-who-is-not-paying-the-bill (and I wasn't, thank
goodness).
> IF this does sound like what you are chasing, please drop me an email
> direct (I'm in & out of the office at present converting some people
> out of Navision, so response will not be immediate)
It does sound like you have done what I'm looking for other than the
free-for-use feature. Since I'm looking for all aspects of the
application to be sans-dollars changing hands, I'm guessing that isn't
a match.
Cheers! --dawn
.
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