Re: does this multi-value product exist?

Hi Henry,

See comments embedded:

csigline@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote: 

Brian Speirs wrote:

What he seemed to be saying to me is that some people approach the
debate from a dogmatic (religious?) viewpoint rather than one based on
reason.


Why is it wrong for me to reason for developing code in a cooperative
Open Source environment?


NO-ONE has said it is wrong.

What IS being said is that you are welcome to use whichever environment you like. What is also being said is that SOME people choose one environment over another for religious reasons rather than for technical ones.

Why is it OK for you to reason for paying someone to use their
proprietary binaries?

What is dogmatic about either position?

Dogma comes not from the position you take, but the reason why you take the position, and the degree to which you are open to changing your position.

I think Tony did suggest this thinking comes more strongly from the open
source movement - and I think that is true.


So what if we put a meter on that and it turns out that you are right?
Does it affect anyone's ability to buy proprietary software?  Did such
strong feelings from the Open Source community interfere with anyone's
rights and abilities to develop proprietary software?  Aha, I know, it
interferes with the pricing model and it forces the proprietary model
to justify its prices.  Just good old competition.  I love it.  What
would the world be like if there were only blondes?

We haven't said anything about those things, and no-one is going to challenge you on those points.

There is a huge dislike and distrust of Microsoft in the open source
community that goes beyond the real problems of software development



Yes, indeed there is the well documented practice of Microsoft using
its cash hoard to buy politicians for the purpose of interfering with
the Open Source model that is causing that dislike and distrust.


Likewise, we haven't claimed that Microsoft is pure as the driven snow.

But where their products are good and widely used, there are times it makes sense to use them.

to more of an ideological stance - 

So you are saying that those who favor proprietary software have no
ideology?


Once again, we haven't said anything of the sort.

<snip> 

Beware entering an ideological war, because all your efforts will only
encourage the other side further <g>.


Brian, what can we in the Open Source community do to encourage the
other side, by which you probably mean M$, further in their stance of
preferring to remain a monopoly?

Henry, I don't think our viewpoint is that different. We both agree that Microsoft is/can be a bully. We both agree that people should be free to use the software of their choice.

All that is really being debated here is the reason WHY some (not all) people choose one system over another. If there are technical and/or financial reasons to favour one product over another, then go for it. However, if the reason is straight bias dressed up as something else, then that is hypocritical.

In the end, this is a criticism of some PEOPLE rather than any comment on the systems they are using (and no, I'm not criticising you or any person in particular - it is a general comment only).

I think that most people here want the open source movement to succeed. But that still doesn't excuse dogmatic positions from the open source movement, or bullying on the part of Microsoft.

Henry Keultjes

Cheers,

Brian
--
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Brian Speirs
h: (04) 479 9032  c: (021) 265 5906
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.

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