Re: Do you feel sorry?

On Mar 27, 8:19 pm, Steve Harder-Kucera <s...@no-spam-
betterwaywebsites.com> wrote:

On 27 Mar 2007 17:54:26 -0700, "EVIL ELVIS"

<hehatemeto...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I do not understand how writing off the percentage of my mortgage,
which goes to the bank, which re-invests in other investments, makes
me a welfare queen (or king). It's not like I am getting a check
every month from the government. I am, in fact, not paying the
government, or getting a write off against the interest I do pay on
the mortgage.

It's simple. Say you and I have the exact same level of income. The
feds hold a gun to our heads at the end of the year and demand 28%
from me, and only 24% from you. You've been given what is the
equivalent of a check for that 4% difference.

That doesn't mean that I am a "welfare recipient". I took advantage
of a deduction that is provided to homeowners.

Besides, I said it was corporate welfare for the mortgage industry.

Yeah, but you also said this: "Of course it's good for everyone who
uses it, the same as the check
that the welfare queens cash every month. It definitely benefits the
recipient to go ahead and cash that check."

I still don't see how writing off taxes makes one a welfare
recipient. And the mortgages are not getting any money from the
government, to my knowledge anyway. I know the airline industry gets
tons of money from the govmt. So does the farm industry, big time.
That's in the form of handouts too.

That's how our government works. It's not a perfect world and people
are people. That's the way life is.

I would have expected a better answer from you. One could use the
sentence above to cover any number of governmental transgressions.

Sometimes the simplest answers are the best. I don't know how else to
respond to your query except to say that's how our system is set up.
If it needs to be changed then we as a people need to change it.
Write your reps., vote, protest, draft a bill, find a tax shelter,
hire a lobbyist or befriend a Senator to change things. All I know is
that's the way it has been for some time.

Home ownership is what makes America the greatest country in the
world. Do you know how many people would like to own their own home
but cannot? I know plenty of people, because I see them every day.
Home ownership makes for a stable economy and middle class. It's
basically what is keeping America afloat. What is the benefit of not
being able to call a place home? You cannot write off rent and you
build no equity. Rents increase, landlords are mean, tenants are loud
and obnoxious, and you basically cannot do anything to modify your
apartment.

Everything you've typed above is irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Where did I indicate that home ownership is a bad thing?

Nowhere. I am just saying that is how things are at work. Heck, the
government is the biggest buyer of mortgages. It makes home ownership
affordable. Banks are govmt. regulated, so the % of prime goes up and
down depending on inflation, among other things.

There is a huge difference between making something affordable vs
helping people buy things they can't afford. If you'll take a look at
what I'm really advocating, it's true home ownership.

I totally agree about advocating home ownership. So does the
government. The fact that things are not affordable are, quite
frankly, due to free market conditions. More people want to live in
So. Cal than So. Dakota. Homes, naturally are more expensive in So.
Cal. than SD. That's market forces at work. The Fed did help create
spending by lowering interest rates. But lower interest rates make
home ownership affordable. Some markets increased (So. Cal., Vegas)
due to jobs, weather, schools, healthcare, etc.

The reason why Vegas home prices increased is due to a number of
things: lower interest rates, strong economy, weather, entertainment.
This lead savvy investors to take advantage of the market. Lots of
people moved into Vegas and there was a shortage of housing. The
prices went up, the buying frenzy was on and there you have it. A
home that was once $125K in 1997 is now worth $400K now. About the
only thing that was NOT a free market in that situation was the Fed
lowering interest rates. And the Fed is a CORPORATION for crying out
loud.

So, by the Fed lowering interest rates, it had 2 different effects on
different places. Isn't that free market at work?

Not equity sharing arrangements with a bank.

If you mean that you don't like to see the bank loan you money that
they charge interest on, well it's their money. They can do what they
want with it, as long as it's legal. If you would like to buy your
home for cash (your money), which some people do, then you can. I
don't like to see the banks change interest rates, but like I stated,
it's the bank's money. And I can use it to my advantage. Why use
your money and add risk when you can use other people's money?

When you get a bank loan, they too are taking a risk. You are
promising the bank that you will pay back a loan with a certain
percentage rate attached and in turn you get the rights to dwell in
that home. Not too many people can afford to buy a home with all
cash, so they go this route. The bank is "banking" on the good faith
that you will make them money by paying for your mortgage on time.
They lose money when your home goes into foreclosure.

As far as the government picking up the tab of a % of the home loan I
pay for, it doesn't work that way. I am basically writing off on the
interest that the bank charges. So I am really not giving the
government my tax money by writing it off. Why pay the bank all that
interest? Why let the government get all your money? They put it
into a big pile and spend, spend, spend. I do realize the importance
of taxes as it goes to military, fire, police, infrastructure,
schools, etc. But I will not pay the govmt. or a bank more than I
need to.

Where have you ever seen me indicate that I believe we should be
paying more taxes?

Nowhere. I don't think that was my point.

The interest I pay on this house by the end of the 30-year full
amortization will be about 3 times as much as the price of the home.
I am basically paying 3 times the amount of the sales price. I
benefit by writing off the interest and I make extra payments and add
on to the payments I currently have. I would rather pay extra every
month and reduce my mortgage amortization length than pay for a longer
period of time.

And I would rather see true market forces at work so that the average
person can afford to truly OWN their home.

"True market" forces were at work, especially in Vegas. Supply and
demand that was set by corporations and an influx of people. Home
builders supplied the supply, the consumers supplied the demand.
Besides, is there really such a thing as a "true/free market"?

The home mortgage deduction
certainly is not the only non-market force driving up the cost of
housing, but it certainly helps contribute to the problem.

Then why did housing prices decline in certain markets? Why is that
some cities are experiencing increases while others are seeing
dramatic declines in housing prices? Same "non-market" forces at work
here, right? I think that even if the deduction wasn't there, you
still would have seen a bunch of investors swooping in. Keep in mind
that housing prices were increasing at 300% in some places! Even if
you take a hit by paying some more in taxes you still come out ahead.

Government sets the policy to "promote the general welfare" of the
people, as provided by the Declaration of Independence and U.S.
Constitution. That is the way some government representatives believe
promotes the general welfare, by enticing the general populace to
purchase homes and become responsible home owners makes our country
stronger. Equity in homes leads to investments in other goods and
services, which creates more jobs and a stonger economy, which creates
more wealth for more people, who in turn buy more homes.

Yep. Equity in homes is good. Much easier to get that equity though
when the product is not so over valued.

But the market drove up those prices. Look at Detroit, an area that
still lost equity and where almost no one was buying homes, even with
a mortgage tax deduction. Is that not market forces at work? Jobs,
crime, weather, healthcare all suck in Detroit. Hence, that's why no
one moves there and why home prices lost value, even with interest
rates as low as they are.

BTW, you government representatives are doing a whole bunch of really
nasty stuff these days in the name of "promoting the general welfare".

I agree. Always have, always will. If we don't like 'em we throw the
bums out.

God, I love this country!

I got news for you brother... It don't love you back..

Sure it does.

It's the government representatives and corporate welfare/military
industrial complex/religious wrong that worries me. Nothing against
corporations or the military, but I believe the reps. should represent
the PEOPLE and not the special interest. Anyone who wants to infringe
on my rights and civil liberties doesn't love me. But I am lucky to
live in a country where we have civil liberties and write offs.
Better than being cramped up in a one bedroom hole in the wall with 5
other families. I know we are not perfect and I do criticize our
government and it's sometimes lazy citizens from time to time. But
it's a great country.

Gosh, I feel so patriotic that I could burn a flag.


--EE--


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