Re: 1080i or 720p

ninphan wrote:
On Nov 22, 3:21 pm, "Matthew L. Martin" <noth...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
ninphan wrote:
On Nov 21, 5:17 pm, "Matthew L. Martin" <noth...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
ninphan wrote:
If the picture has no motion, you should not see any difference at all.
With motion, each point in time certainly has only 540 lines to resolve
what changed since the previous point in time (scan field). When displayed
as 1080 lines, it can still be interpolated. By detecting that motion did
take place, the display (conversion) can choose to make the missing lines
(the odd ones in an even field, for example) be filled in from interpolated
content rather than the previous field held steady. Sure, it is technically
just 540 lines of information. But that gets blended with a _different_
540 lines in the next field. You might lose those very thin horizontal
lines, but they are almost certainly not an issue when motion is involved.
This is only applicable if the material is being shot in 1080i and
most cameras used in the field that are NOT using film, are shooting
1080p/24 (either at 1440x1080 or more recently in the last three or
four years at 1920x1080)
Outside of consumer usage interlaced footage is rare. What I'm stating
is that a 1080p source, delivered interlaced, will deinterlace pixel
for pixel back to that 1080p source.
And you are wrong. The act of filtering a progessive source into an
interlaced stream that has to be properly displayed on an interlaced
display causes information to be lost forever.
You, of course, know better, no matter how wrong you are.
Matthew
--
"All you need to start an asylum is an empty room and the right kind of
people". Alexander Bullock ("My Man Godfrey" 1936):- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
This isn't done anymore - there are no "proper 1080i" televisions
outside of a handful of CRT's. That doesn't even make up 1% of the
current HDTV market.
I'm sure you have an authoritative citation to back that up, don't you?
I'd prefer something other than a wiki reference, because you don't
believe them to be credible.

Take your time, I'll wait.

Matthew

--
"All you need to start an asylum is an empty room and the right kind of
people". Alexander Bullock ("My Man Godfrey" 1936):- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

All you need to do is look up NPD numbers for the last several years
to see this. These are numbers the companies themselves are releasing.
You can follow the various press conferences from IFA, CEDIA, CES,
etc.

So the answer is: No, I don't have an authoritative source that I can cite for my claim.

OK. You don't.

Go ahead and find me a non-CRT "proper 1080i" television. That would
be one with 1080 lines of vertical resolution that does not support
progressive scan.

I have mentioned the ALiS technology Plasma displays many times. They are interlaced. They are usually 1024x1024.

Most editing is not done in interlaced format as most filming is not
filmed interlaced.

Oh please. Of course anything that is captured on film is progressive. Virtually everything broadcast in 1080i is interlaced. How do you think they got the interlace media to broadcast? Magic?

Take "Lost" for example, it is edited in 1080p/24.
Yes there is 1080i/60 editing, but it's done from a progressive source
and converted back to a progressive source afterwards with no loss of
data. 1080i/60, remove 2:3, back to 1080p/24

Here you use your claim to "prove" your claim. Any conversion from progressive to interlaced that is done properly involves the aforementioned vertical filtering. You can look it up.

Sorry, you just don't get it. I'm not talking about progressive content on media from a progressive source. I'm talking about any content that has been converted for interlace display or captured with an interlaced camera. If the whole chain was progressive there is no work for a de-interlacer to do.

If something is being de-interlaced, it was converted to or captured as interlaced and information that a progressive capture would have had is *not* recaptured by de-interlacing.

http://www.panasonic.com/business/provideo/app_hd_faqs.asp

A careful reading of that source shows nothing to support your theory that information lost during the capture of or conversion to interlaced format can be recovered by de-interlacers.

I give up. You really are determined to remain ignorant, just like poor old phil.

Matthew

--
"All you need to start an asylum is an empty room and the right kind of people". Alexander Bullock ("My Man Godfrey" 1936):
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Why interlaced HDTV?
    ... A progressive display can be configured to display interlaced material perfectly correctly. ... That particular trade-off results in 50Hz flicker, but no worse than on a conventional interlaced CRT. ... However there is a third trade-off which maintains the flicker elimination of these screens. ... You can display interlaced images on a progressive screen correctly, and I suspect that the reason it isn't done has more to do with manufacturers agendas than a limitation of interlace per se. ...
    (uk.tech.digital-tv)
  • Re: HDV camcorder with 720p
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    (rec.video.desktop)
  • Re: Why interlaced HDTV?
    ... >To display such a signal with the whole picture changing 50 times per second ... which is why interlace has been used by all broadcasters since the ... >Updating only one field's worth of the picture, or half the number of picture ... which is why there is a move to 1080p/720p 50 FRAME ...
    (uk.tech.digital-tv)
  • Re: Upconverting question
    ... It is more of a concern how the interlace is performed and what ... The big advantage I see in all the new formats in DTV is alternatives to ... Then a 24 fps video stream could be upscanned to 48 fps or 72 fps ... need for the content source to dictate the actual display rate. ...
    (alt.tv.tech.hdtv)
  • Re: Question about i vs. p
    ... > Yeah but all film scanners and most video cameras capture progressive ... > and create the interlace in digital memory. ... even if progressive monitors force interlaced signals to be ... a 60Hz display is not normally ...
    (alt.tv.tech.hdtv)