Re: The Latest on China and DTV

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 00:51:48 GMT Bob Miller <bob@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

| Manufacturers make what broadcasters want. Broadcasters have already
| been testing the two in cities around China. Five for VSB and 30 to 40,
| heard 40 today, for TD-OFDM. Broadcasters in China are overwhelmingly
| for TD-OFDM and that is why manufacturers are NOT going to offer
| anything for VSB. A few months ago they WERE going to support VSB but
| now, only days after the choice was made, the market has already spoken.
| If there were a demand for VSB then there would be manufacturers ready
| to supply it.

| What I am reading between the lines is that since the overwhelming
| majority, read all, of broadcasters are choosing TD-OFDM, the
| manufacturers are going out of their way to announce that they will not
| support VSB so as to cut off the odd-ball broadcaster from even thinking
| about it.

If few (read almost no) want VSB, it's clearly not profitable to add
the capability in receivers. I do think we both agree that having 2
or more electable standards of modulation just adds to the cost.
Keeping the costs low is a good thing.

But I'm not convinced that it's a case of broadcasters choosing and
manufacturers of receivers going with it. I believe that had the
broadcasters chosen VSB, the manufacturers may have balked at that
and dragged their feet to product products, just as they are doing
today in the USA>


| I know of no evidence that VSB is more expensive and or less profitable
| than TD-OFDM on the transmitter side. I did hear that in the US 8-VSB
| was substantially less expensive than COFDM on the transmit side.
| According to your theory that would make manufacturers be for it.
| However I remember a big US manufacturer crying crocodile tears over the
| disaster that 8-VSB was after they supported it.

The big issue I see is what manufacturers are wanting to do on the
receive side.


| As soon as 8-VSB was official broadcasters went to the FCC asking for
| low power status and killing the immediate sales that transmitter
| manufacturers were counting on. If it had been a decision for COFDM
| their sales would have gone though the roof IMO.

Why would their desired for initial low power have been any different
had COFDM been the standard?


| On the receive side I think it would be a wash in a country like China.
| Very big market, fast penetration, they would reach bottom of the barrel
| prices with either modulation because of incredible sales between now
| and the Olympics.

So how is the US different?


| If COFDM had or was allowed then dual receivers would be easy to make
| and not much more expensive. To add COFDM to an 8-VSB receiver would be
| a few dollars. Less than $6. They already exist without any mandate.
| Here is one.
| http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?nov-lcd37d&P=0

Why would something like this need ATSC? They might take their 37 inch
display to North America?


| But if COFDM was allowed in the US then immediately, the same thing that
| is happening in China would happen here. DAY ONE all broadcasters with
| the possible exception of CBS, would immediately switch to COFDM. I say
| with the exception of CBS because someone is really stupid there.

I just have not see anything that suggests to me that the choice would
be so slanted.


| No China did the testing extensively with the public in many cities.
| They then made the right technical call. They chose the best modulation
| for all the right reasons. And this was done in the market with
| broadcasters, the public and manufacturers interacting. No need to go
| any further.
|
| Their decision is in line with the decisions made in all other countries
| except the US. The US decision, made for corrupt political reasons for
| 8-VSB caused the decisions of S. Korea, Canada and Mexico on other then
| technical grounds.
|
| Any country that looked at the technical merits chose a form of COFDM.

I just don't see it that way for the US.

But if you can get Congress to consider a law to amend the tuner mandate
to expand it to mandate both 8VSB and COFDM, I would not object to it,
assuming it's only $6 more per unit. Worst case, my portable TV could
work in Europe, too. Maybe it would end up working on some other things,
too, like amateur radio transmissions. But in time that would open the
option for broadcasters to switch.

--
|---------------------------------------/----------------------------------|
| Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org) / Do not send to the address below |
| first name lower case at ipal.net / spamtrap-2006-09-14-0341@xxxxxxxx |
|------------------------------------/-------------------------------------|
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: The Latest on China and DTV
    ... Broadcasters have already | been testing the two in cities around China. ... Five for VSB and 30 to 40, | heard 40 today, for TD-OFDM. ... Broadcasters in China are overwhelmingly | for TD-OFDM and that is why manufacturers are NOT going to offer | anything for VSB. ...
    (alt.tv.tech.hdtv)
  • Re: The Latest on China and DTV
    ... The VSB is | a much improved version of the US 8-VSB. ... | Broadcasters, manufacturers of transmitters, chip manufacturers and | receiver manufacturers can all choose what they want to use. ... choice by the broadcasters be based on technical merits of VSB vs. ... I did hear that in the US 8-VSB was substantially less expensive than COFDM on the transmit side. ...
    (alt.tv.tech.hdtv)
  • Re: The Latest on China and DTV
    ... The VSB is ... choice by the broadcasters be based on technical merits of VSB vs. ... let the manufacturers decide which modulation design gives ...
    (alt.tv.tech.hdtv)
  • The Latest on China and DTV
    ... The Chinese standard is dual with a VSB and a TD-OFDM option. ... Broadcasters, manufacturers of transmitters, chip manufacturers and receiver manufacturers can all choose what they want to use. ... At that time 8-VSB proponents knew that if COFDM was allowed in the US that 8-VSB was finished. ...
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